From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 08:49:00 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id IAA18975; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:49:00 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id IAA18964 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:48:58 +1300 Received: from phaeton.ihug.co.nz (p17-max23.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.102.145]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA10540 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:37:23 +1300 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981118083322.007ba100@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:33:22 +1300 Subject: RE: I wonder..... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Keith Smith To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. >Speaking of which, can someone clear up the cock up in the spell >description >which isn't actually english for me? >Is it supposed to be 1 hex plus 1 hex radius per rank? 1 hex per rank? Ouch. I missed that one in the last proofread. It should be 'The area that may be affected is a 1 hex area of ground (+1/Rank)' ^^^^^^ I presume that means it's one extra hex per rank. Could the new rulebook editor please make the correction as indicated above? Keith (phaeton@ihug.co.nz) -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 08:56:13 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id IAA19005; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:56:13 +1300 Received: from fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz ([203.98.14.148] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id IAA18996 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:56:11 +1300 Received: from falaklnt000.falum.co.nz ([10.8.1.20]) by fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.1 release 219 ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id nz ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:44:06 +1300 Received: by falaklnt000.falum.co.nz with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BE12D0.22F34B60@falaklnt000.falum.co.nz>; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:47:56 +1300 Message-ID: Subject: RE: Spell Explanations Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:47:54 +1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. I think it is imperative that spell descriptions give an indication as >to how the spell achieves its affects. >If the spell had some explanantion as to how it works, then consistancy would >be easier to maintain. >---------- However, a scientific explanation will usually detract from the spell's mystique & the game's flavour. Even a simple, "pseudo-fantasy/Renaissance/medieval" explanation is tricky, without getting too involved in this mindset. For example, the four humors, elements, and temperaments are great philosophic explanations, but not appropriate for spells. Neither is some explanation about splitting the spectrum of light - no matter when Newton discovered this, it isn't in genre. A simple, "generic" explanation is best if required. Example - Fear: * This spell increases the flow of cortisol and noradrenalin in the target, so that they are seized by uncontrollable fear and must roll on the Fright Table. (Only affect things with blood?) * This spell dampens the sanguine and phlegmatic temperaments of the target, so that they are seized by uncontrollable fear and must roll on the Fright Table. (Only affect things with sentience? personality?) * The target of this spell is seized by uncontrollable fear and must roll on the Fright table. (A little boring, but clear) * The target of this spell is uncontrollably seized by their subconscious fears and must roll on the Fright table. ("subconscious" is scientific, but only a bit) Andrew this post> -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 09:01:19 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id JAA19037; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:01:19 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id JAA19028 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:01:18 +1300 Received: from phaeton.ihug.co.nz (p17-max23.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.102.145]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA11836 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:49:32 +1300 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981118084532.007ba8d0@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:45:32 +1300 Subject: Re: Earth Tremor Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Keith Smith To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. At 17:45 17/11/98 +1300, you wrote: > >CURRENT WRITE-UP: > >Earth Tremor (S-11) >Range: 15 feet + 15 / Rank >Duration: 5 seconds + 5 / Rank >Experience Multiple: 350 >Base Chance: 20% >Resist: May not be resisted >Storage: Investment, Ward, Magical Trap >Target: Area >Effect: By the use of this spell the Adept causes the very earth to >pitch and roll uncontrollably as though in a tremendous earthquake. The >area that >may be affected is a 1 hex area of around (+ 1 / Rank). Any Entities ^^^^^^ =20 I'm fairly sure that's meant to be 'ground' and as someone pointed out, maybe it should state that the hexs need to be contiguous - although that's implied in the description. >within the Area must roll less than or equal to 1 =D7 AG to retain their >footing. >Those who fail to remain standing fall prone immediately and may not >rise for the duration of the tremor. Objects within the Area will tend >to topple >and roll around. If the spell is cast under part of, or all of, a >building, wall, or other such construction, significant structural >damage will occur, probably >causing partial or total collapse. Keith (phaeton@ihug.co.nz) -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 09:08:54 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id JAA19070; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:08:54 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id JAA19059 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:08:53 +1300 Received: from phaeton.ihug.co.nz (p17-max23.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.102.145]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA12760 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:57:18 +1300 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981118085319.007d26d0@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:53:19 +1300 Subject: Re: I wonder..... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Keith Smith To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. >> But I seem to remember it being quite a high EM. >> Perhaps 1 hex radius per 4 full ranks or somesuch. >> >> E.g at rank 8 you get a hex plus 2 rings of hexes around that. > >At the moment, the spell has a fairly small area of effect if you were >trying to make a circular area of effect. So far, you're actually >increasing the area of effect, although not until Rank 12...Still... >Is there anything wrong with the area of effect at the moment? Personally I don't think so. Currently at Rank 7 you can get a hex plus one ring around it (a megahex). but it won't be until Rank 19 that you can get the hex and 2 rings of hexes around it. Keith (phaeton@ihug.co.nz) -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 09:47:33 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id JAA19130; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:47:33 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id JAA19121 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:47:32 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p231-tnt-ak-1.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.111.231]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA22101 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:35:50 +1300 Message-Id: <199811172035.JAA22101@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: Spell Explanations Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:31:23 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. ---------- > From: Brent & Sally > [I acknowlege that some people do not see consistancy as desirable, so > please do not feel compelled to rehash that argument]. Then, why, pray, rehash the consistency argument? Jim. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 09:50:50 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id JAA19158; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:50:50 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id JAA19147 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:50:49 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p231-tnt-ak-1.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.111.231]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA22509 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:39:09 +1300 Message-Id: <199811172039.JAA22509@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: Spell Explanations Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:37:03 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. ---------- > From: Andrew Withy (FAL AKL) > Example - Fear: > > * This spell increases the flow of cortisol and noradrenalin in the > target, so that they are seized by uncontrollable fear and must roll on > the Fright Table. (Only affect things with blood?) > > * This spell dampens the sanguine and phlegmatic temperaments of the > target, so that they are seized by uncontrollable fear and must roll on > the Fright Table. (Only affect things with sentience? personality?) > > * The target of this spell is seized by uncontrollable fear and must > roll on the Fright table. (A little boring, but clear) > > * The target of this spell is uncontrollably seized by their > subconscious fears and must roll on the Fright table. ("subconscious" is > scientific, but only a bit) Such extensive detailing of the exact workings of the spell tend to prevent players from providing a rationalisation of their own as to how the spell works. Jim. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 10:30:22 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA19221; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:30:22 +1300 Received: from smtp.worley.co.nz (smtp.worley.co.nz [202.36.210.250]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id KAA19212 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:30:19 +1300 Received: by smtp.worley.co.nz(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.1 (569.2 2-6-1998)) id 4C2566BF.007BDA62 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:32:48 +1200 X-Lotus-FromDomain: WORLEY CONSULTANTS Message-ID: <4C2566BF.0079CE9F.00@smtp.worley.co.nz> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:19:00 +1200 Subject: Re: Spell Explanations Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline From: amtennant@worley.co.nz To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. >I think it is imperative that spell descriptions give an indication as to >how the spell achieves its affects. This is necessary in order to increase >the chances of getting more consistant rulings when spells are used in >unusual circumstances or used imaginatively to achieve things that the >spell was not designed for. For example, I have had a creative E+E mage >turn himself invisible while trekking across the desert in order to avoid >getting sunburnt. As GM I ruled that this would work, based on my >assumption that E+E Invisibility made things transparent. The problem with this is that if you assume that it makes you 100% transparent then you wouldn't be able to see because light would pass through your eyes and optic nerves etc... ( if, of course, that's how people actually see in a fantasy world... :) Therefore, light must still be contacting you and you're being made "invisible" some other way. Therefore you would get sunburnt. >Other GMs may >well rule differently. If the spell had some explanantion as to how it >works, then consistancy would be easier to maintain. True. But if you leave it vague, then as Jim suggests, players can make their own rationalisations for how their spell works. L8R, Adam. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 10:31:19 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA19247; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:31:19 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id KAA19236 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:31:17 +1300 Received: from phaeton.ihug.co.nz (p229-tnt-ak-1.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.111.229]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA27688 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:19:41 +1300 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981118101541.007bad20@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:15:41 +1300 Subject: Revised notes on the message lists. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Keith Smith To: dq-announce@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq-announce@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. A Guide to the DQ Mailing Lists The lists - and what they're for To aid in campaign and rules discussion, three e-mail mailing lists have been set up. These are dq-annouce, dq and dq-pub. Currently they are hosted by the domain dq.sf.org.nz Each list has the following uses: dq-announce - This is for the postings of agendas, minutes, and proposal documents only. dq - This is for general discussion for rules and campaign issues. Any replies to messages posted in dq-announce should be sent here. No in-character messages should be posted to this group. dq-pub - This list is for in-character announcements, discussions, and general chit-chat. (Think of a public bar in an inn). The reason that there are different groups is that some people only wish to subscribe to announcements or they have work related accounts that they cannot use for discussions. Users could also have a different e-mail address for each list if they wished. Using the Lists Send your message to the appropriate list i.e. @dq.sf.org.nz If you are replying to a message that has been sent to the list, then please remember that the reply will go to whatever was put in the 'Reply To:' field in the message header. For messages sent to dq-announce and dq this will default to the dq list. This means that replies go on to the list instead of to the person that sent it. To circumvent this, either copy/paste the original e-mail address to the 'To' field or change the 'Reply To' field (if possible) - some mailers refer to this as 'Have replies sent to'. (Note: Some people already have their default 'reply to' set to their own address instead of the list. I presume that is a function of how their mailer is set up which overrides the list default.) Notes about messaging 1) Remember to quote relevant bits of the original message in your reply. This refreshes the reader's memory about what you're replying to. This is especially important when there are several message threads running at once, or it's been a while since the original message has been read. I find it easier to put the replies after the quoted sections and intersperse the quotes and replies. Also, leaving a blank line between quoted sections and the new text makes the message easier to read. 2) Try and keep the messages to within 80 columns. 75 is preferable to allow room for replies to quite them. This avoids line-wrap. 2) Because of the way the list is set up, your replies to list messages will get read by everyone on the list. In some circumstances it may be better to send the reply direct to the person who sent the original. Please think about that before sending. This is especially important now that the default reply is to the list, rather than to the person who sent it. (There are exceptions - see the note above). 3) If you're sending an attachment, please remember that not everyone can read formats such as Word or Wordperfect. Text (ASCII) format is usually safe but is devoid of any formatting characteristics. If you are sending a non-ASCII document, please indicate what format it is in the body of the covering message. Graphics should preferably be in JPEG or GIF formats. 4) Attachments need to be kept short. Not just to save time in transmission/reception but also some systems have a limit in the size of messages that can be passed through. For our server this is 10MB - including overheads. Best to keep it under 5-6MB. Some other systems have even lower limits. Using ZIP or similar utilities would help with large text or PDF files but will have absolutely no effect of JPEG or GIF as they're already compressed. List maintenance Because the current host mailing system is manually maintained, unlike stimpy, all subscriptions to the list have to be handled by the list administrator. To subscribe (join) or unsubscribe (leave) a list the user needs to e-mail the administrator at dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz with the required details such as e-mail address and which lists to be added (or subtracted) from. If you wish to find out who is on the list then you need to request this from the administrator at the address above. A list of names can be provided but e-mail addresses may not be owing to current privacy policies. Most people on the list can be accessed by mailing to .@dq.sf.org.nz There shouldn't be too many problems with messages to the list bouncing, unless the list is down. If this occurs send a message to owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz notifying them of the problem. If an e-mail address on the list is no longer valid then a copy of the message to that address will be bounced back to owner-dq. If you do get a strange message from the list, then e-mail owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz with the details, including the entire text of that message as the header information contains important clues about what has happened. In case you have managed to lose messages, either through accidently deleting them, or the mail server managed to 'eat' them, an archive for each day is stored at the address http://dq.sf.org.nz/archive/ as text files. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 13:56:59 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id NAA19628; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 13:56:59 +1300 Received: from kcbbs.gen.nz (kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.1]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id NAA19617 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 13:56:58 +1300 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by kcbbs.gen.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA08186 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 13:42:20 +1300 (NZDT) Message-ID: <36521607.A9F3DB47@games.co.nz> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 13:34:15 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Healer Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Mike Young To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Andrew Luxton wrote: > Terry asked: > >If a limb is removed from an unlucky individual, can a healer reattach the > limb? > > > >In your responses please indicate what categories you option falls > >* is supported by the rules, > >* is what everyone plays, > >* is what you think the rules should support. > (snip) > (iii) > I don't really care either way. If I had to make a choice, I think I would > favour limbs not being able to be reattached. Healers are not like > surgeons (in spite of the *nasty* reference in the Healer skill to cosmetic > surgery - blah). I like to think of Healers as working with the essence of > life (as a whole body) and being able to restore that body to its true > form. I think that once parts are removed, they are unable to be worked > with by a healer as they are no longer part of the entity. Anything to > make Healer more mystical and less surgeon-like I am keen on. I pick him. Regards, Michael Young -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 14:08:43 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA19677; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:08:43 +1300 Received: from fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz ([203.98.14.148] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA19668 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:08:42 +1300 Received: from falaklnt000.falum.co.nz ([10.8.1.20]) by fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.1 release 219 ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id nz ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 13:56:26 +1300 Received: by falaklnt000.falum.co.nz with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BE12FB.CD92BDF0@falaklnt000.falum.co.nz>; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:00:30 +1300 Message-ID: Subject: RE: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:00:28 +1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. If people agree with Andrew L & Michael Y, perhaps we should change Healer such that: 1) Cosmetic surgery is removed or reworded 2) Healer is actually easy to read & find things! 3) The mystical flavour is emphasised - so that people won't talk about nerves, transplants, reattachment, cosmetic surgery, and worst of all, CPR. 4) Currently undefined abilities like stopping bleeding are covered briefly. At the same time, healer being more adventurer orientated - less (50-3xRank hours) abilities? As an aside, this might leave room for a skill like surgeon/alchemist/herbalist/barber with knives, poltices and powders, for really brave adventurers & many "real" people. I don't volunteer for this, though I can produce a "pared-down" version with less verbiage as a start... Andrew W >---------- >I like to think of Healers as working with the essence of life (as a whole >body) and being able to restore that body to its true >Anything to make Healer more mystical and less surgeon-like I am keen on. > > -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 14:33:21 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA19753; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:33:21 +1300 Received: from date.palm.cri.nz (date.palm.cri.nz [161.66.1.20]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA19744 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:33:17 +1300 Received: from mail1.marc.cri.nz (mail1.marc.cri.nz [161.29.1.1]) by date.palm.cri.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA27333 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:21:41 +1300 (NZDT) Received: from hra1.marc.cri.nz (unverified [161.29.1.5]) by mail1.marc.cri.nz (Dr Solomon's SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:17:13 +1300 Message-Id: Received: from HRA1/SpoolDir by hra1.marc.cri.nz (Mercury 1.31); 18 Nov 98 14:22:27 GMT+12 Received: from SpoolDir by HRA1 (Mercury 1.31); 18 Nov 98 14:22:03 GMT+12 Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:22:00 GMT+1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: Healer X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT From: "Bart Janssen" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Subject: RE: Healer Date sent: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:00:28 +1300 From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Send reply to: dq@dq.sf.org.nz > > If people agree with Andrew L & Michael Y, perhaps we should change > Healer such that: I personally do not agree with Andrew L and Mike Y, their view is one extreme view of healer and balance is needed. BTW I think Stephen is already assigned to the healer project. Again you definately need a couple of predominantly healer characters on the team making changes or you'll screw up too many things. cheers Bart > 1) Cosmetic surgery is removed or reworded > 2) Healer is actually easy to read & find things! > 3) The mystical flavour is emphasised - so that people won't talk about > nerves, transplants, reattachment, cosmetic surgery, and worst of all, > CPR. > 4) Currently undefined abilities like stopping bleeding are covered > briefly. > > At the same time, healer being more adventurer orientated - less > (50-3xRank hours) abilities? > > As an aside, this might leave room for a skill like > surgeon/alchemist/herbalist/barber with knives, poltices and powders, > for really brave adventurers & many "real" people. > > I don't volunteer for this, though I can produce a "pared-down" version > with less verbiage as a start... > > Andrew W > >---------- > >I like to think of Healers as working with the essence of life (as a whole > >body) and being able to restore that body to its true > >Anything to make Healer more mystical and less surgeon-like I am keen on. > > > > > > -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- Saying Windows 95 is equal to Macintosh is like finding a potato that looks like Jesus and believing you've witnessed the second coming. -- Guy Kawasaki Bart Janssen Hort+Research Private Bag 92169 Auckland New Zealand ph 64 9 8154200 x 7279 fax 64 9 8154201 -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 14:43:50 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA19802; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:43:50 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA19792 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:43:49 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p19-max42.akl.ihug.co.nz [209.79.137.83]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA25426 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:32:11 +1300 Message-Id: <199811180132.OAA25426@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:30:04 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. ---------- > From: Bart Janssen > > I personally do not agree with Andrew L and Mike Y, their view is one > extreme view of healer and balance is needed. > > BTW I think Stephen is already assigned to the healer project. > > Again you definately need a couple of predominantly healer characters > on the team making changes or you'll screw up too many things. > Their view is not extreme. It is merely within genre, and apparently, in opposition to your own. Balance is not needed, merely because you don't like the way someone describes something. Whoever is assigned to the current Healer project is a matter of academic interest, only. You do not need predominantly Healer characters to do anything, really, unless you want to live with constant procrastination. I like Andrew Luxton's rationalisation. I'd like to see a proprosed rewrite on the skill from Andrew Withy. Jim. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 14:45:13 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA19833; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:45:13 +1300 Received: from peace.com (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id OAA19823 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:45:06 +1300 Received: via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/pcnz2.7) id OAA01200; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:33:29 +1300 Message-ID: <3652257B.7E80EAD3@peace.com> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:40:11 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5b2 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Healer Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" wrote: > If people agree with Andrew L & Michael Y, perhaps we should change > Healer such that: [snip] > healer being more adventurer orientated - less > (50-3xRank hours) abilities? Just to kibbitz on this specific point... One thing that I have played around with -- and am in favour of -- is keeping the time to heal the same but decreasing the amount of contiguous time that the _healer_ has to do it for. Currently a 50-3/r ability ties up the healer PC and hence their player in a way that is inherently boring and often serves to bog a party down. Joe Schmoe breaks his leg... great thinks the GM, I get to torture err... I mean entertain Joe and his broken leg for lots of hours. Healer starts work and says that it'll take 30 odd hours to fix, so now with two PCs busy the party decide to camp for a day...dull, dull, dull... Fun "healer" role-playing consists of "I'll heal Joe" <30 hours pass> "OK, I'm done". dull...dull...dull... My suggestion is that the Healer begins the process, expends some FT and then checks up on Joe every few hours and "boosts" (or whatever you want to call it) the healing process, possibly expending some extra FT for the effort. This way there is just as much penalty for being spec-ed/squashed/broken/folded/spindled and mutilated, more possibly of hobbling around on broken limbs, and less boring-ness for the player of the Healer. A subsidary idea is that several Healers can co-operate, either to increase the healing time... or possibly if there is an FT cost at every "boost" to share the FT expenditure. Cheers, Martin -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 14:46:20 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA19859; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:46:20 +1300 Received: from fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz ([203.98.14.148] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA19849 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:46:19 +1300 Received: from falaklnt000.falum.co.nz ([10.8.1.20]) by fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.1 release 219 ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id nz ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:34:00 +1300 Received: by falaklnt000.falum.co.nz with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BE1301.0CBD9A40@falaklnt000.falum.co.nz>; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:38:04 +1300 Message-ID: Subject: Quickness Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:38:00 +1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Been meaning to do this for some time: I "quit" the quickness project - I had a few ideas, they don't sound like what the group wants, so I have no more to provide in this area. Good Luck to whoever wants to take it on. Gripe: BTW, if this (and similar problems) is to be fixed, the people wanting an opposed combat system should either produce something or stop using it as an excuse for sinking other combat changes. This was the major reason that discussion didn't develop my ideas into something usable, or give clear feedback as to why they weren't useful. Andrew -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 14:50:31 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA19908; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:50:31 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA19899 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:50:30 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p19-max42.akl.ihug.co.nz [209.79.137.83]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA26083 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:38:52 +1300 Message-Id: <199811180138.OAA26083@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: Spell Explanations Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:37:03 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. ---------- > From: Brent & Sally > I think it is imperative that spell descriptions give an indication as to > how the spell achieves its affects. This is necessary in order to increase > the chances of getting more consistant rulings when spells are used in > unusual circumstances or used imaginatively to achieve things that the > spell was not designed for. For example, I have had a creative E+E mage > turn himself invisible while trekking across the desert in order to avoid > getting sunburnt. As GM I ruled that this would work, based on my > assumption that E+E Invisibility made things transparent. Other GMs may > well rule differently. If the spell had some explanantion as to how it > works, then consistancy would be easier to maintain. In a completely different matter, this example first appeared in a Dragon article, around '84 (I think, along with a question from a DM on whether or not a warrior should be able to use the hobbit in +2 leather armour to batter a vampire to death, once his magical weapon had been broken). I suggest that this was a very derived use of the spell. Jim. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 14:51:26 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA19933; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:51:26 +1300 Received: from smtp2.ihug.co.nz (root@tk2.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.14]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA19923 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:51:20 +1300 Received: from phaeton.ihug.co.nz (p33-max37.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.106.33]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA16143 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:39:40 +1300 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981118143542.007c8d70@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:35:42 +1300 Subject: RE: Healer Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Keith Smith To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. >BTW I think Stephen is already assigned to the healer project. > >Again you definately need a couple of predominantly healer characters >on the team making changes or you'll screw up too many things. Need any help on this one? Keith (phaeton@ihug.co.nz) -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 14:58:24 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA20017; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:58:24 +1300 Received: from peace.com (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id OAA20006 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:58:23 +1300 Received: via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/pcnz2.7) id OAA01799; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:46:42 +1300 Message-ID: <36522894.31BFC395@peace.com> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:53:24 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5b2 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Healer Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. And on other matters... "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" wrote: > If people agree with Andrew L & Michael Y, perhaps we should change > Healer such that: > 1) Cosmetic surgery is removed or reworded I have often felt that the cosmetic surgery note went against the rest of the feeling of Healer. > 2) Healer is actually easy to read & find things! Yay! > 3) The mystical flavour is emphasised - so that people won't talk about > nerves, transplants, reattachment, cosmetic surgery, and worst of all, > CPR. I don't have any problem with re-attaching limbs. There seems to me nothing less mystical about re-attaching a "dead" limb to a live body and having it live again, than of bringing an entire dead body back to life... more of a change in degree rather than kind. And it certainly seems no less mystical to me than regeneration. Nerves, transplants, cosmetic surgery and CPR I can live without... with the possible exception that I think Healers should be able to save "mostly dead" victims of drowning and the like. Starting someones heart again is called "ressurection", but getting water out of their lungs might be somewhat easier. > 4) Currently undefined abilities like stopping bleeding are covered > briefly. More "hook-in" points would be good too. When we were looking for a way to limit Witch restoratives it turned out that there was no convenient point to hook-in a pt of damage from Ulcers... kinda mundane I know, but you'd think it wouldn't need a Rk 6 or 7 to deal with it. Cheers, Martin -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 14:58:17 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA19994; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:58:17 +1300 Received: from fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz ([203.98.14.148] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA19984 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:58:12 +1300 Received: from falaklnt000.falum.co.nz ([10.8.1.20]) by fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.1 release 219 ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id nz ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:45:53 +1300 Received: by falaklnt000.falum.co.nz with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BE1302.B670F130@falaklnt000.falum.co.nz>; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:49:58 +1300 Message-ID: Subject: RE: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:49:56 +1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. >> healer being more adventurer orientated - less (50-3xRank hours) abilities? > >My suggestion is that the Healer begins the process, expends some FT and then >checks up on Joe every few hours and "boosts" (or whatever you want to call >it) >the healing process, possibly expending some extra FT for the effort. How about the Healer spends FT normally, then spends 5 minutes and 1 extra FT in advance for each hour of freedom that they want? - that way, sitting down for the entire 30 hours is better for the healer and patient, but the Healer can spend 2 1/2 hours, a spare 30 FT (plus the 9 to heal them normally) in 20 minute bursts between flights, while others prepare a hot meal, casts other spells, etc. You can also spend 8 FT to get a good night's sleep. Advantages: 1) Optional. 2) Can start/stop this at any time. 3) Allows co-operation between healers. 4) Allows lots of running around on broken legs - "you'll be fine for 4 hours - just don't break anything else" - "Aarrgghh!" - "run faster". 5) No re-write of healing times needed. Problems: 1) Is this too complex/numeric? It is an "optional" rule, however - you can always just spend the time. 2) Does this burn too much FT? 3) What happened if you forget your patient?- you spend 4 FT, and after 6 hours remember your patient. I would guess that they gain 4 hours healing, then a "break" of 2 hours, where they may get worse or the same. Other Healers could help by providing some of the extra FT either directly if high enough rank, or to the Healer if Rank 3. Lower ranks can stop infection, soothe pain as usual, or just hold the patient down. Optionally, if more healers spend the FT, it might get faster somehow? Too complex? Andrew -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 15:11:03 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id PAA20094; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:11:03 +1300 Received: from date.palm.cri.nz (date.palm.cri.nz [161.66.1.20]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id PAA20083 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:11:02 +1300 Received: from mail1.marc.cri.nz (mail1.marc.cri.nz [161.29.1.1]) by date.palm.cri.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA28344 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:59:28 +1300 (NZDT) Received: from hra1.marc.cri.nz (unverified [161.29.1.5]) by mail1.marc.cri.nz (Dr Solomon's SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:55:02 +1300 Message-Id: Received: from HRA1/SpoolDir by hra1.marc.cri.nz (Mercury 1.31); 18 Nov 98 15:00:16 GMT+12 Received: from SpoolDir by HRA1 (Mercury 1.31); 18 Nov 98 15:00:06 GMT+12 Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:00:01 GMT+1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: Healer X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT From: "Bart Janssen" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Subject: RE: Healer Date sent: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:49:56 +1300 From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Send reply to: dq@dq.sf.org.nz > > >> healer being more adventurer orientated - less (50-3xRank hours) abilities? > > > >My suggestion is that the Healer begins the process, expends some FT and then > >checks up on Joe every few hours and "boosts" (or whatever you want to call > >it) > >the healing process, possibly expending some extra FT for the effort. > > How about the Healer spends FT normally, then spends 5 minutes and 1 > extra FT in advance for each hour of freedom that they want? - that way, > sitting down for the entire 30 hours is better for the healer and > patient, but the Healer can spend 2 1/2 hours, a spare 30 FT (plus the 9 > to heal them normally) in 20 minute bursts between flights, while others > prepare a hot meal, casts other spells, etc. You can also spend 8 FT to > get a good night's sleep. I thought the aim was to make it easier. What you propose means either the healer sits on his bum and doesn't roleplay for 30 hours or whatever or they srtip themselves of all fatigue and don't roleplay for 30 hours. You've got be kidding. healing is already expensive on fatigue > Advantages: > 1) Optional. > 2) Can start/stop this at any time. > 3) Allows co-operation between healers. > 4) Allows lots of running around on broken legs - "you'll be fine for 4 > hours - just don't break anything else" - "Aarrgghh!" - "run faster". > 5) No re-write of healing times needed. Sorry the only solution to the problems healers face is to rewrite the times to something reasonable. OR you just say healing is an NPC skill only > Problems: > 1) Is this too complex/numeric? It is an "optional" rule, however - you > can always just spend the time. yes for the mathematically challanged (aka cretins) > 2) Does this burn too much FT? yes > 3) What happened if you forget your patient?- you spend 4 FT, and after > 6 hours remember your patient. I would guess that they gain 4 hours > healing, then a "break" of 2 hours, where they may get worse or the > same. great so a responsible healer never leaves his patient. Sorry but this is a non-solution > Other Healers could help by providing some of the extra FT either > directly if high enough rank, or to the Healer if Rank 3. Lower ranks > can stop infection, soothe pain as usual, or just hold the patient down. > Optionally, if more healers spend the FT, it might get faster somehow? > Too complex? yup, just fix the times to something reasonable. Saying Windows 95 is equal to Macintosh is like finding a potato that looks like Jesus and believing you've witnessed the second coming. -- Guy Kawasaki Bart Janssen Hort+Research Private Bag 92169 Auckland New Zealand ph 64 9 8154200 x 7279 fax 64 9 8154201 -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 15:17:52 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id PAA20149; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:17:52 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id PAA20138 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:17:51 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p19-max42.akl.ihug.co.nz [209.79.137.83]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA28846 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:06:13 +1300 Message-Id: <199811180206.PAA28846@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:04:25 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. ---------- > From: Martin Dickson > > One thing that I have played around with -- and am in favour of -- is keeping > the time to heal the same but decreasing the amount of contiguous time that the > _healer_ has to do it for. > > Currently a 50-3/r ability ties up the healer PC and hence their player in a > way that is inherently boring and often serves to bog a party down. Joe Schmoe > breaks his leg... great thinks the GM, I get to torture err... I mean entertain > Joe and his broken leg for lots of hours. Healer starts work and says that > it'll take 30 odd hours to fix, so now with two PCs busy the party decide to > camp for a day...dull, dull, dull... Fun "healer" role-playing consists of > "I'll heal Joe" <30 hours pass> "OK, I'm done". dull...dull...dull... > > My suggestion is: (various suggestions) ... I think that your point about Healing taking ages is, on the one hand, good, because it means that players are going to spend a lot of time limping around, and generally suffering, and bad on the other hand, because it takes out the Healer character for the healing time as well, is well made, Martin. I pretty much agree with you. All serious injury does is produce pressure within the party to stop doing anything and heal up. In a party of six, if a non-Healer is hurt, then 1/3 of the party are occupied in doing repairs, assuming that option exists to do Healing at all. If it doesn't, then the players are forced to soldier on. The way Healing works, I imagine, is that the Healer chappie looks you over, shaking his head, and muttering heartwarming things like 'Woe, woe, and thrice, woe...' Then he does some weird thing, and you start to feel better (or you don't). My feeling is that Healing just gives you a boost in the direction of health, and then you wander off down that path, pretty much on your own. Admittedly, some kinds of healing may require a bit more attention to the road signs. Once having started the victim off, the Healer may have to be around for occasional course corrections (you're occasional disembowelment, for example), but, in general, the victim will begin to get better pretty much on their own. I think that a treatment time for an injury is reasonable. I doubt that that will get much shorter with Rank, though. The rate at which the victim recovers from an injury after the attentions of the Healer will be greater, the higher the Rank. In other words, a highly Ranked Healer is still going to take, say, half an hour to set a broken leg, as would a medium Ranked Healer, but the rate at which the leg heals is going to be greater, the better you are. Let us assume that the FT cost of each ability is the same as they are now, and that the cost is only paid at the very beginning of the Healing. Let us also assume that the injury, once Healed, is on the road to recovery from that point on...Unless something happens to re-open the wounds, like a fight, falling into an open sewer, wild abandoned sex with a centaur... The character should be subject to a higher chance of infection, possibly even moral revision, in some circumstances, and so a Healer may have to respend the treatment FT and time, putting the character back together (assuming you'd be keen on touching someone that had been that intimate with a centaur)... Jim. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 15:22:48 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id PAA20197; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:22:48 +1300 Received: from smtp2.ihug.co.nz (root@tk2.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.14]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id PAA20186 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:22:47 +1300 Received: from phaeton.ihug.co.nz (p33-max37.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.106.33]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA20228 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:11:09 +1300 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981118150712.007cf880@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:07:12 +1300 Subject: Work in Progress Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Keith Smith To: dq-announce@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq-announce@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Below is the current Work in Progress list as a reminder to people currently engaged in projects. Could you please adveise me if there are any changes. Thanks, Keith (phaeton@ihug.co.nz) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------ WORK IN PROGRESS Skills Herbalist Jim Arona Forwarded to Struan. May be picked up by Jacqui. Languages Jon McSpadden/Mike Parkinson In Progress Warrior/Fighting skills Ian Wood/Jono Bean Ready for playtest Colleges Binder Stephen Martin New version under playtest Fire Paul Schmidt On hold pending Paul's return Rune Jon McSpadden In Progress Mind clarification Jacqui In Progress Namer Martin In Progress Magic Elemental Binding Rituals Brent Jackson Playtest, feedback required Stacking Magic Stephen Martin To be resubmitted Weapon spells Stephen Martin Controlled playtest Wiccan Special Alchemy Michael Woodhams To be resubmitted Light/Dark spells Jacqui/Martin In progress Forbidding Ritual Stephen To be resubmitted Greater Enchantments Jeff Leddra Waiting for proposal Install Flight Martin/Andrew Waiting for proposal Witchsight v Invisibility ???? Open Topic Curse removal For e-mail discussion Waters/Restoratives For e-mail discussion Other Cold Iron Martin Dickson To be resubmitted -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 15:23:22 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id PAA20219; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:23:22 +1300 Received: from date.palm.cri.nz (date.palm.cri.nz [161.66.1.20]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id PAA20210 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:23:21 +1300 Received: from mail1.marc.cri.nz (mail1.marc.cri.nz [161.29.1.1]) by date.palm.cri.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA28645 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:11:44 +1300 (NZDT) Received: from hra1.marc.cri.nz (unverified [161.29.1.5]) by mail1.marc.cri.nz (Dr Solomon's SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:07:24 +1300 Message-Id: Received: from HRA1/SpoolDir by hra1.marc.cri.nz (Mercury 1.31); 18 Nov 98 15:12:39 GMT+12 Received: from SpoolDir by HRA1 (Mercury 1.31); 18 Nov 98 15:12:34 GMT+12 Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:12:33 GMT+1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Healer X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT From: "Bart Janssen" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. > Their view is not extreme. It is merely within genre, as defined by whom? > and apparently, in > opposition to your own. Not entirely but it is an extreme opinion > Balance is not needed, merely because you don't like the way someone > describes something. But you see Jim just as you are the only GM who matters in DQ I am the only player that counts... I see so balance is only needed when you want something and not when someone else wants something, try reading your own posts Jim (I know they are hard to stomach but it might proive worthwhile). Note I did not say my opinion was not also extreme, what I said was that, in response to Andrew W's suggestion that we all agree with Mike Y and Andrew L there is at least one person who does not agree with their opinion and that a balanced approach was better. > Whoever is assigned to the current Healer project is a matter of academic > interest, only. Why? What a stupid comment, shit Jim use your brain did it occur to you that the person assigned to the task might have already made drafts and that it might be sensible to use those drafts doh! > You do not need predominantly Healer characters to do anything, really, > unless you want to live with constant procrastination. I'd much rather procrastinate than see healer fucked up. But what the hey this is a democratic organistaion if the majority want to fuck up healer then go for it. just don't take two opinions and assume that is the consensus. > I like Andrew Luxton's rationalisation. > I'd like to see a proprosed rewrite on the skill from Andrew Withy. Good for you. Glad to see you supporting something. My opinion is different, I doubt that I am alone in my opinion and I'd like to see a balanced compromise, do you have a problem with that? cheers Bart (yes I am feeling crappy today and I overreacted) Saying Windows 95 is equal to Macintosh is like finding a potato that looks like Jesus and believing you've witnessed the second coming. -- Guy Kawasaki Bart Janssen Hort+Research Private Bag 92169 Auckland New Zealand ph 64 9 8154200 x 7279 fax 64 9 8154201 -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 15:31:28 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id PAA20283; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:31:28 +1300 Received: from mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (mailhost.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.1.4]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id PAA20274 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:31:27 +1300 Received: from sci4 (lbr-122-42.lbrsc.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.122.42]) by mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (8.9.1/8.9.1/8.9.1-ua) with SMTP id PAA23554 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:19:50 +1300 (NZDT) Message-Id: <199811180219.PAA23554@mailhost.auckland.ac.nz> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:23:36 +0000 Subject: RE: Healer X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) From: "Michael Parkinson" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-to: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Dear all, concerning > Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:00:28 +1300 > From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" > 1) Cosmetic surgery is removed or reworded Cosmetic surgery may be a desirable concept for our game, but it is heavily polluted with modern overtones. Although I *have* used it in games to physically alter NPC (& PC) appearances, one *could* argue that healers can only repair damaged flesh -- thus they can (depending upon level) restore a lost eye, or remove the scars resulting from injury but that they can't "repair" an ugly nose because that is what the patient is, intrinsically; it would be akin to alterring some letters of a particular Individual True Name. Similarly a healer could not cut away "excess" flesh or wrinkles, because that is the natural maturation of the individual, not any injury or sickness. A healer can only prolong life -- you need a special magician to actually make the patient any younger. > 2) Healer is actually easy to read & find things! Even if you do nothing else -- please do this > 3) The mystical flavour is emphasised - so that people won't talk about > nerves, transplants, reattachment, cosmetic surgery, and worst of all, > CPR. Agreed. Perhaps we should just stick to Flesh, Bones and Organs. PROVIDED that we actually also specify *what* bits of a human body are organs, using traditional concepts. Say Heart -- seat of compassion; Liver -- seat of the anima; Brain -- seat of the intellect; or what ever [Aristotelians please correct my errors]. and a couple more, perhaps; > 4) Currently undefined abilities like stopping bleeding are covered > briefly. > > At the same time, healer being more adventurer orientated - less > (50-3xRank hours) abilities? I tentatively agree -- A balance needs to be struck between what is dramatic (why have a good fight if everybody is uneffected a few minuts later) and what is practical (As GM you want the party to progress). One *game* problem with being wounded is that the GM is sometimes forcing one player (the Healer's player, if not the patient's) to do almost nothing for 30-odd hours of game time -- I've tried it, its boring. I see nothing wrong with a "walking wounded" category. E.g., Paitent can be *mostly* healed of their damage, say all but -1pt Endurance for every endurance blow they took, and that last bit of endurance is recovered "naturally". Also because healing is magical [or quasi-magical], why not emphasise the Nostrums. E.g., patient is mostly cured (as in preceeding paragraph), but every morning and evening until restored to full health they must: ritually bathe; or spend half-an-hour in prayer to Raphael; or recite a specific magical formula 7 times; or perform an act of contrition; feasting on a particular diet; or whatever -- according to the cult or collegium of the healer. regards, Michael Michael Parkinson Assistant Librarian Email: m.parkinson@auckland.ac.nz Science Library Phone: (9) 3737 599 x 5858 University of Auckland Fax: (9) 3082 304 -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 15:42:36 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id PAA20344; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:42:36 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id PAA20334 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:42:34 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p19-max42.akl.ihug.co.nz [209.79.137.83]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA31398 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:30:54 +1300 Message-Id: <199811180230.PAA31398@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:29:06 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. ---------- > From: Andrew Withy (FAL AKL) > How about the Healer spends FT normally, then spends 5 minutes and 1 > extra FT in advance for each hour of freedom that they want? - that way, > sitting down for the entire 30 hours is better for the healer and > patient, but the Healer can spend 2 1/2 hours, a spare 30 FT (plus the 9 > to heal them normally) in 20 minute bursts between flights, while others > prepare a hot meal, casts other spells, etc. You can also spend 8 FT to > get a good night's sleep. > > Advantages: > 1) Optional. > 2) Can start/stop this at any time. My impression of healing is that the best time to do it is as soon after the injury as possible, and to go through until the subject is stable. Until the patient is stable, you can't really stop and start. Once the patient is stable, then you have to spend time correcting whatever is wrong. That, also, is not a stop/start affair. Regular checks, however, are obviously intermittent. > 3) Allows co-operation between healers. Bonus. Lots of Healers can only be good for you...unless they're the 2nd Aid variety.... > 4) Allows lots of running around on broken legs - "you'll be fine for 4 > hours - just don't break anything else" - "Aarrgghh!" - "run faster". I'm not sure what you mean, here, Andrew. If you mean the patient is 'mystically' Healed of their broken leg for 4 hours, then I dislike it deeply. If you mean that the injury will not get any worse for 4 hours, then I suppose it's fine. > 5) No re-write of healing times needed. That may be true. But I think that the way that the Healing times work are pretty flawed, and don't really capture the flavour of recovery. I think that this advantage is purely bureaucratic. > > Problems: > 1) Is this too complex/numeric? It is an "optional" rule, however - you > can always just spend the time. I don't think so, really, and I'm one who has difficulty with using a lot of numbers. I don't like this part of your idea, not because it requires numeracy, but because it makes it a bit of an accounting excercise. I'd rather have some other method, given a choice. > 2) Does this burn too much FT? It will tend to mean that most Healing gets done at night, just before the Healer goes to sleep, since that is the time of greatest FT recovery. This isn't a bad thing, mind you. There are lots of associations of sleep being a healing balm, and the idea of dawn bringing new hope and strength to the afflicted. It may get a bit samey, though. > 3) What happened if you forget your patient?- you spend 4 FT, and after > 6 hours remember your patient. I would guess that they gain 4 hours > healing, then a "break" of 2 hours, where they may get worse or the > same. > Well, would you? I mean, that's the sort of thing that a player might do, because they've just got up to put the coffee on, and while they were away, the game has moved on a bit. In reality, the patient would be constantly whining about how bad they felt, and waving their body parts in your face. I suppose the situation might arise where you weren't able to treat them when you're Healing ran out. This is one or the reasons I don't like it, really. > Other Healers could help by providing some of the extra FT either > directly if high enough rank, or to the Healer if Rank 3. They can do this, now. > Lower ranks can stop infection, soothe pain as usual, or just hold the patient down. > Optionally, if more healers spend the FT, it might get faster somehow? > Too complex? I don't think so. It's just a bit of an accounting excercise, though, Andrew. Jim. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 15:49:18 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id PAA20380; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:49:18 +1300 Received: from peace.com (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id PAA20370 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:49:16 +1300 Received: via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/pcnz2.7) id PAA04394; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:37:38 +1300 Message-ID: <3652347F.D5BDCC46@peace.com> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:44:15 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5b2 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Healer Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Bart Janssen wrote: > > >Martin : My suggestion is that the Healer begins the process, expends some FT > and then > > >checks up on Joe every few hours and "boosts" (or whatever you want to call > > >it) the healing process, possibly expending some extra FT for the effort. > > Andrew: How about the Healer spends FT normally, then spends 5 minutes and 1 > > extra FT in advance for each hour of freedom that they want? etc > > I thought the aim was to make it easier. [snip] > Sorry the only solution to the problems healers face is to rewrite the > times to something reasonable. OR you just say healing is an NPC > skill only What I was suggesting was that the time to heal (for the patient) remains the same, but the Healer's involvement time is decreased -- and I'd like it simple too. Something like (making it up on the fly)... 1. Start the healing process, pay "x" FT (what it is at the moment?) ... every "y" hours (possibly rank dependant, but probably not, since the healing time is already rank dependant) check up on the patient and pay "z" FT (probably 1 point). 2. If the Healer doesn't check up on the patient and continue the process then it halts and must be restarted. Restarting takes "x" FT again. 3. The rank of the Healer who did the initial work is used to determine the Healing time. 4. Any Healer capable of the healing process involved may do a check up (and spend the 1 FT). So... example... (and I may have the ranks wrong here)... plugging in some numbers. Fixing bones is Rank 6, yes? OK.... Ambar (Rank 9), Bob the Healer (Rank 6), and Prentice John (Rank 3) are in a party when Joe breaks his leg. Ambar "lays hands" and starts the healing process, pays the 6 FT and sets the Healing time at (50 - (9 x 3) ) = 23 hours -- none too shabby. Then every 4 hours the process must be boosted/continued/checked at a cost of 1 FT. Either Ambar or Bob can do this... but not John because he is not capable of repairing bones. So Ambar starts the process (and gets the low heal time) and pays the big FT cost, but can get some sleep will Bob does the continuing work. If after say 12 hours everybody forgets to check up on Joe the process halts (with 11 hours remaining) and will need 6 more FT to re-start (the time is not recalculated). --- I know this is long and wordy but the concept is very simple. It achieves a number of things: 1. It lets multiple Healers co-operate on a patient, but not but writing off the contribution of the best, and also limits participation to those who have spent the considerable ep and time to gain abilities. 2. It lest me as GM torment Joe for many hours with a broken leg -- this is lots more fun than either non-specific damage, or killing him. 3. It rewards conscientious Healers. 4. It frees up the Healer PC to do other things, with only a very moderate ongoing commitment and cost. Cheers, Martin -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 15:54:23 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id PAA20425; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:54:23 +1300 Received: from fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (fep1-orange.clear.net.nz [203.97.32.1]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id PAA20416 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:54:20 +1300 Received: from qed_akl_nt_1.qed.co.nz ([203.97.23.141]) by fep1-orange.clear.net.nz (1.5/1.11) with ESMTP id PAA19241; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:42:08 +1300 (NZDT) Received: by qed_akl_nt_1.qed.co.nz with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:42:46 +1300 Message-ID: <15A7D8BC5E3ED2119E2E0000F82150FC010A41@qed_akl_nt_1.qed.co.nz> Subject: RE: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:42:41 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain From: Stephen Martin To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. This doesn't have to be in the rules for a Healer to require it of their patients :}. > -----Original Message----- > From: Michael Parkinson [SMTP:M.parkinson@auckland.ac.nz] > Sent: Thursday, November 19, 1998 4:24 AM ... > every morning and evening until restored to full health they must: > ritually bathe; > or spend half-an-hour in prayer to Raphael; > or recite a specific magical formula 7 times; > or perform an act of contrition; > feasting on a particular diet; > or whatever -- according to the cult or collegium of the healer. > > regards, Michael > -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 16:02:33 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id QAA20486; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:02:33 +1300 Received: from smtp2.ihug.co.nz (root@tk2.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.14]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id QAA20477 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:02:32 +1300 Received: from phaeton.ihug.co.nz (p33-max37.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.106.33]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA24906 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:50:54 +1300 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981118154657.007d3690@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:46:57 +1300 Subject: Re: Healer Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Keith Smith To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. >The way Healing works, I imagine, is that the Healer chappie looks you >over, shaking his head, and muttering heartwarming things like 'Woe, woe, >and thrice, woe...' Then he does some weird thing, and you start to feel >better (or you don't). My feeling is that Healing just gives you a boost in >the direction of health, and then you wander off down that path, pretty >much on your own. >Admittedly, some kinds of healing may require a bit more attention to the >road signs. Once having started the victim off, the Healer may have to be >around for occasional course corrections (you're occasional disembowelment, >for example), but, in general, the victim will begin to get better pretty >much on their own. Yes. That's the way I see it as well. >I think that a treatment time for an injury is reasonable. I doubt that >that will get much shorter with Rank, though. >The rate at which the victim recovers from an injury after the attentions >of the Healer will be greater, the higher the Rank. In other words, a >highly Ranked Healer is still going to take, say, half an hour to set a >broken leg, as would a medium Ranked Healer, but the rate at which the leg >heals is going to be greater, the better you are. A rested person should Heal faster than a person who is travelling in my opinion. >moral revision, in some circumstances, and so a Healer may have to respend >the treatment FT and time, putting the character back together (assuming >you'd be keen on touching someone that had been that intimate with a >centaur)... If it's gotta be done, it's gotta be done. Keith (phaeton@ihug.co.nz) -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 15:57:43 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id PAA20458; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:57:43 +1300 Received: from smtp2.ihug.co.nz (root@tk2.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.14]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id PAA20449 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:57:42 +1300 Received: from phaeton.ihug.co.nz (p33-max37.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.106.33]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA24441 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:46:04 +1300 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981118154207.007d1970@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:42:07 +1300 Subject: RE: Healer Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Keith Smith To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. >How about the Healer spends FT normally, then spends 5 minutes and 1 >extra FT in advance for each hour of freedom that they want? - that way, >sitting down for the entire 30 hours is better for the healer and >patient, but the Healer can spend 2 1/2 hours, a spare 30 FT (plus the 9 >to heal them normally) in 20 minute bursts between flights, while others >prepare a hot meal, casts other spells, etc. You can also spend 8 FT to >get a good night's sleep. I only see this working if you've got more than one Healer in the party and you can 'rotate' their services, otherwise the Healer character will still be low on fatigue, especially if they're a spellcasting support mage as well. Personally I don't think the Healer has to spend continuous time with their patient, but just enough to 'keep an eye on things'. Depending on the injury the patient may be able to travel, with or without assistance (stretcher, travois, strapped to a horse, etc). Besides, how many Healers have a spare 30FT? >Other Healers could help by providing some of the extra FT either >directly if high enough rank, or to the Healer if Rank 3. Lower ranks >can stop infection, soothe pain as usual, or just hold the patient down. >Optionally, if more healers spend the FT, it might get faster somehow? >Too complex? Hmmm. Probably. It does help to have more Healers say, one to do Empathy while the senior Healer is doing something else. I don't think the Healing would get faster although if two Healers were doing the same thing i.e. a regeneration, the time may be 25% faster. There would be diminishing returns if more Healers joined in. Keith (phaeton@ihug.co.nz) -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 16:07:17 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id QAA20560; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:07:17 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id QAA20550 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:07:16 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p19-max42.akl.ihug.co.nz [209.79.137.83]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA01541 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:55:34 +1300 Message-Id: <199811180255.PAA01541@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:53:45 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. ---------- > From: Bart Janssen > To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz > Subject: Re: Healer > Date: Thursday, November 19, 1998 4:12 AM > > > > > > Their view is not extreme. It is merely within genre, > > as defined by whom? As defined by Fantasy, Bart. Can you point to a Fantasy source, outside of this game that uses the idea of cosmetic surgery? > > > and apparently, in > > opposition to your own. > > Not entirely but it is an extreme opinion If someone rewrote the skill, changing no rule at all, merely saying that Healer's treat the soul or some other ethereal part of the patient, and got rid of the part about the different types of innards they can affect, how would that be extreme? > > > Balance is not needed, merely because you don't like the way someone > > describes something. > > But you see Jim just as you are the only GM who matters in DQ I am > the only player that counts... > I don't know, Bart, I've never DMed you. I only know that some DMs I respect don't want to DM you anymore. > I see so balance is only needed when you want something and not > when someone else wants something, try reading your own posts Jim (I > know they are hard to stomach but it might proive worthwhile). Barely worth responding to, so I am, barely. > > Note I did not say my opinion was not also extreme, what I said was > that, in response to Andrew W's suggestion that we all agree with Mike > Y and Andrew L there is at least one person who does not agree with > their opinion and that a balanced approach was better. What has balance got to do with Andrew's suggestion? It doesn't alter the balance of the game at all, as far as I can see. They are merely saying that they prefer that Healing seem more mystical. They would like to see it changed to reflect that. > > > Whoever is assigned to the current Healer project is a matter of academic > > interest, only. > > Why? What a stupid comment, shit Jim use your brain did it occur to > you that the person assigned to the task might have already made > drafts and that it might be sensible to use those drafts doh! > Thank you for an elucidation of the extent of your vocabulary, Bart. I am, as always, impressed with the degree to which you are verbally challenged. So what if someone has made up draughts? This is a suggestion about colour. It is not a suggestion about content. But, then, I forget, you're verbally challenged, aren't you, Bart. Sometimes, the bigger words get too much for you... Even if it were about content, the existence of someone who is doing work on something does not rule discussion out. Regardless of what they might be writing. > > You do not need predominantly Healer characters to do anything, really, > > unless you want to live with constant procrastination. > > I'd much rather procrastinate than see healer fucked up. But what the > hey this is a democratic organistaion if the majority want to fuck up > healer then go for it. just don't take two opinions and assume that is > the consensus. > So, you agree, then? Players of Healers would be more likely to procrastinate, than do anything? On, the other point, I seriously doubt that the majority of players would not like the rationalisation offered by Andrew. I never, however, raised any issue of consensus, or made any assumptions based on it. > I like Andrew Luxton's rationalisation. > > I'd like to see a proprosed rewrite on the skill from Andrew Withy. > > Good for you. Glad to see you supporting something. My opinion is > different, I doubt that I am alone in my opinion and I'd like to see a > balanced compromise, do you have a problem with that? > Well, yes, Bart. On the grounds that I haven't seen anything on the issue from Andrew, it will be almost impossible to come to any compromise. You cannot form a compromise based on something that doesn't exist. > cheers > Bart (yes I am feeling crappy today and I overreacted) I see, Bart. Is there any chance of this feeling ending? Will puberty solve your problems, do you think? Jim. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 16:08:55 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id QAA20584; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:08:55 +1300 Received: from smtp2.ihug.co.nz (root@tk2.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.14]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id QAA20575 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:08:50 +1300 Received: from phaeton.ihug.co.nz (p33-max37.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.106.33]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA25535 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:57:08 +1300 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981118155312.007b5b80@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:53:12 +1300 Subject: Re: Healer Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Keith Smith To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. [snip] >I know this is long and wordy but the concept is very simple. It achieves a number >of things: > >1. It lets multiple Healers co-operate on a patient, but not but writing off the >contribution of the best, and also limits participation to those who have spent the >considerable ep and time to gain abilities. >2. It lest me as GM torment Joe for many hours with a broken leg -- this is lots >more fun than either non-specific damage, or killing him. >3. It rewards conscientious Healers. >4. It frees up the Healer PC to do other things, with only a very moderate ongoing >commitment and cost. I like this. It means that load is shared around the Healers in the party. Could something like this be added easily? Keith (phaeton@ihug.co.nz) -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 16:11:04 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id QAA20622; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:11:04 +1300 Received: from fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz ([203.98.14.148] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id QAA20613 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:11:01 +1300 Received: from falaklnt000.falum.co.nz ([10.8.1.20]) by fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.1 release 219 ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id nz ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:58:20 +1300 Received: by falaklnt000.falum.co.nz with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BE130C.D5D7D660@falaklnt000.falum.co.nz>; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:02:26 +1300 Message-ID: Subject: RE: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:02:21 +1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. This was essentially what I was trying to suggest , with y=z=1, x=Rk as always. Increasing y as Martin suggests reduces FT costs. Sorry for my opacity. Andrew >---------- >What I was suggesting was that the time to heal (for the patient) remains the >same, >but the Healer's involvement time is decreased -- and I'd like it simple too. > >Something like (making it up on the fly)... > >1. Start the healing process, pay "x" FT (what it is at the moment?) ... >every "y" >hours (possibly rank dependant, but probably not, since the healing time is >already >rank dependant) check up on the patient and pay "z" FT (probably 1 point). >2. If the Healer doesn't check up on the patient and continue the process >then it >halts and must be restarted. Restarting takes "x" FT again. >3. The rank of the Healer who did the initial work is used to determine the >Healing >time. >4. Any Healer capable of the healing process involved may do a check up (and >spend >the 1 FT). > -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 16:19:11 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id QAA20672; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:19:11 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id QAA20661 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:19:10 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p19-max42.akl.ihug.co.nz [209.79.137.83]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA03325 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:07:31 +1300 Message-Id: <199811180307.QAA03325@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:00:49 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. ---------- > From: Stephen Martin > To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz > Subject: RE: Healer > Date: Wednesday, November 18, 1998 3:42 PM > > > This doesn't have to be in the rules for a Healer to require it of their > patients :}. Excellent...I must have a go...I hope we're not going to get finicky and rule out 50 situps for infidels who've been treated for wounds to the viscera... Rowan Velcanthus, S.C. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 16:19:15 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id QAA20685; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:19:15 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id QAA20674 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:19:14 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p19-max42.akl.ihug.co.nz [209.79.137.83]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA03333 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:07:33 +1300 Message-Id: <199811180307.QAA03333@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:05:44 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. ---------- > From: Michael Parkinson > Also because healing is magical [or quasi-magical], why not emphasise the > Nostrums. E.g., patient is mostly cured (as in preceeding paragraph), but > every morning and evening until restored to full health they must: > ritually bathe; > or spend half-an-hour in prayer to Raphael; > or recite a specific magical formula 7 times; > or perform an act of contrition; > feasting on a particular diet; > or whatever -- according to the cult or collegium of the healer. I'm not too keen on the stuff about points of EN per Endurance Injury, but I really like these nostrum thingies...They would be an excellent addition to the game, so long as there effect is pretty minor...They could be an interesting hook to hang recovery on, as well as specific nostrums to particular ailments... I would like to see more of this kind of thing. It has real flavour. Jim. -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 16:35:07 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id QAA20742; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:35:07 +1300 Received: from smtp2.ihug.co.nz (root@tk2.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.14]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id QAA20732 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:35:05 +1300 Received: from homeserver (p23-max28.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.103.215]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA28810 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:23:05 +1300 Message-ID: <009c01be12a2$c468d880$d76712ce@homeserver.Home> Subject: Re: Work in Progress Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:23:08 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 From: "rodking" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: "rodking" X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Ye verily I have returned and collated all responses for Fire. Will post to the list on request - its all a bit lengthy. Cheers Paul -----Original Message----- From: Keith Smith To: dq-announce@dq.sf.org.nz Date: Wednesday, November 18, 1998 3:12 PM Subject: Work in Progress > >Below is the current Work in Progress list as a reminder to people >currently engaged in projects. > >Could you please adveise me if there are any changes. > >Thanks, > >Keith >(phaeton@ihug.co.nz) > >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- - >------ > > WORK IN PROGRESS > >Skills >Herbalist Jim Arona Forwarded to Struan. May > be picked up by Jacqui. >Languages Jon McSpadden/Mike Parkinson In Progress >Warrior/Fighting skills Ian Wood/Jono Bean Ready for playtest > >Colleges >Binder Stephen Martin New version under playtest >Fire Paul Schmidt On hold pending Paul's > return >Rune Jon McSpadden In Progress >Mind clarification Jacqui In Progress >Namer Martin In Progress > >Magic >Elemental Binding Rituals Brent Jackson Playtest, feedback required >Stacking Magic Stephen Martin To be resubmitted >Weapon spells Stephen Martin Controlled playtest >Wiccan Special Alchemy Michael Woodhams To be resubmitted >Light/Dark spells Jacqui/Martin In progress >Forbidding Ritual Stephen To be resubmitted >Greater Enchantments Jeff Leddra Waiting for proposal >Install Flight Martin/Andrew Waiting for proposal >Witchsight v Invisibility ???? Open Topic >Curse removal For e-mail discussion >Waters/Restoratives For e-mail discussion > >Other >Cold Iron Martin Dickson To be resubmitted > > > > >-- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- > -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 16:38:24 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id QAA20776; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:38:24 +1300 Received: from fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz ([203.98.14.148] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id QAA20765 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:38:21 +1300 Received: from falaklnt000.falum.co.nz ([10.8.1.20]) by fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.1 release 219 ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id nz ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:25:58 +1300 Received: by falaklnt000.falum.co.nz with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BE1310.B24E4130@falaklnt000.falum.co.nz>; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:30:04 +1300 Message-ID: Subject: RE: Healer Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:30:03 +1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Jim; I suggest that you get someone else to cure the internal bleeding that it causes, otherwise you'll get awfully tired. Remind me to rank Healer before adventuring with Rowan again. :) Andrew >---------- >From: Jim Arona[SMTP:jimarona@ihug.co.nz] >Sent: Thursday, 19 November 1998 5:00 >To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz >Subject: Re: Healer > > > > >---------- >> From: Stephen Martin >> To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz >> Subject: RE: Healer >> Date: Wednesday, November 18, 1998 3:42 PM >> >> >> This doesn't have to be in the rules for a Healer to require it of their >> patients :}. > >Excellent...I must have a go...I hope we're not going to get finicky and >rule out 50 situps for infidels who've been treated for wounds to the >viscera... > >Rowan Velcanthus, S.C. > >-- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- > -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 16:49:31 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id QAA20826; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:49:31 +1300 Received: from date.palm.cri.nz (date.palm.cri.nz [161.66.1.20]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id QAA20815 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:49:29 +1300 Received: from mail1.marc.cri.nz (mail1.marc.cri.nz [161.29.1.1]) by date.palm.cri.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA00997 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:37:54 +1300 (NZDT) Received: from hra1.marc.cri.nz (unverified [161.29.1.5]) by mail1.marc.cri.nz (Dr Solomon's SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:33:25 +1300 Message-Id: Received: from HRA1/SpoolDir by hra1.marc.cri.nz (Mercury 1.31); 18 Nov 98 16:38:41 GMT+12 Received: from SpoolDir by HRA1 (Mercury 1.31); 18 Nov 98 16:38:31 GMT+12 Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:38:28 GMT+1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Healer X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT From: "Bart Janssen" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. > > as defined by whom? > > As defined by Fantasy, Bart. Can you point to a Fantasy source, outside of > this game that uses the idea of cosmetic surgery? Sorry I don't have an encyclopedic memory of every fantasy novel i've read but I have definately seen healers in fantasy change the appearance of another. And what's so special about your version of fantasy genre anyway. Sorry but I play my healer as a rennaisance man who has spent a huge amount of time and effort to understand the inner workings of the sentients he heals. Your version of fantasy says I wave my hands and "something happens" personally I find that kind of roleplaying unsatisfying. that is why I find that kind of definition of what healers do "extreme". > > > and apparently, in > > > opposition to your own. > > > > Not entirely but it is an extreme opinion > > If someone rewrote the skill, changing no rule at all, merely saying that > Healer's treat the soul or some other ethereal part of the patient, and got > rid of the part about the different types of innards they can affect, how > would that be extreme? Because it would force me to roleplay my character in a particular way, I find that method of DMing revolting. Ambar is a rennaisance healer who understands intimately exactly what he does. Ambar has trained as a surgeon to that end specifically. There are several other healers with just that view of healing. You seem to feel that is "out of genre" and should be deleted from the game without regard for what others feel. Defining genre narrows roleplaying options, it should be approached with utmost caution. You seem confident that you can define genre for us all without harming the game, I think you are wrong. > I don't know, Bart, I've never DMed you. I only know that some DMs I > respect don't want to DM you anymore. Nice to see you recycling arguements. MTB won't GM me ever again [Bart's breaks down and cries]. Jim repsects MTB as a GM [Bart is so amused that he is quite recovered from his disappointment] > What has balance got to do with Andrew's suggestion? It doesn't alter the > balance of the game at all, as far as I can see. They are merely saying > that they prefer that Healing seem more mystical. They would like to see it > changed to reflect that. Andrews suggestion is an extreme view of genre and not balanced, as is Mike Y's and Andrew L's > > Why? What a stupid comment, shit Jim use your brain did it occur to > > you that the person assigned to the task might have already made > > drafts and that it might be sensible to use those drafts doh! > > > Thank you for an elucidation of the extent of your vocabulary, Bart. I am, > as always, impressed with the degree to which you are verbally challenged. > So what if someone has made up draughts? If you can't use your brain then at least use a dictionary Jim, or did you mean to imply that someone may have just poured drinks > This is a suggestion about colour. > It is not a suggestion about content. But, then, I forget, you're verbally > challenged, aren't you, Bart. Sometimes, the bigger words get too much for > you... Are you suggestion colour and flavour are not part of content? Surely not after what I've seen you post over the last two weeks demanding that flavour was critical to the game and now arguing that changing colour is of no consequence to any existing drafts??? Are you being deliberately hypocritical? > Even if it were about content, the existence of someone who is doing work > on something does not rule discussion out. Regardless of what they might be > writing. Except that if Andrew W wants to contribute he might be smarter to look at the existing drafts (there's that difficult word again) otherwise he might being doing work that had already been done. This must be a really difficult concept for you. > > > You do not need predominantly Healer characters to do anything, really, > > > unless you want to live with constant procrastination. > > > > I'd much rather procrastinate than see healer fucked up. But what the > > hey this is a democratic organistaion if the majority want to fuck up > > healer then go for it. just don't take two opinions and assume that is > > the consensus. > > > So, you agree, then? Players of Healers would be more likely to > procrastinate, than do anything? Reading impaired as well as mathematically and socially impaired I see. No I am saying that I would rather see no change to healer than the kind of stupid narrow minded changes suggested by the two mentioned which define only one kind of healer character as possible. Make rules and structure then let the players decide how they want to roleplay. Oh I forgot Jim thinks that he is gods gift to roleplaying and can tell us all how to do it better .......hah! > Well, yes, Bart. On the grounds that I haven't seen anything on the issue > from Andrew, it will be almost impossible to come to any compromise. You > cannot form a compromise based on something that doesn't exist. But he did propose a "kind of change" and mooted that there was general agreement. I posted to make sure that he knew that agreement had not been reached and to let him know that a previous draft existed that he might look at before starting what is probably a painful task. Try looking back at my post, you responded with your usual drivel apparantly with purpose of indicating that you'll disagree with me regardless of what i say (read your reply). > I see, Bart. Is there any chance of this feeling ending? Will puberty solve > your problems, do you think? Another wonderfully erudite and meaningful comment from someone with, no friends, no career, and no life, meant to cause me emotional pain because I have the temerity disagree with him. You Jim are the most revolting piece of trash I've ever had the misfortune to interact with. I presume you are the product of child abuse and this persona you manefest is the best your counselors could achieve. It is sad and pathetic that you can find no other way to interact with humanity than abuse and conflict. I guess pity is the only reasonable response, but I never claimed to be reasonable. Bart Saying Windows 95 is equal to Macintosh is like finding a potato that looks like Jesus and believing you've witnessed the second coming. -- Guy Kawasaki Bart Janssen Hort+Research Private Bag 92169 Auckland New Zealand ph 64 9 8154200 x 7279 fax 64 9 8154201 -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 17:42:19 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id RAA20933; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 17:42:19 +1300 Received: from kcbbs.gen.nz (kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.1]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id RAA20922 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 17:42:19 +1300 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by kcbbs.gen.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA24073 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 17:27:36 +1300 (NZDT) Message-ID: <3652448E.A95CAA7D@games.co.nz> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:52:46 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Healer Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------2E5318B95C156E161AECDB2C" From: Mike Young To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. --------------2E5318B95C156E161AECDB2C Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Since we have started with the mud slinging again. Here's mine. Bart Janssen wrote: >>I personally do not agree with Andrew L and Mike Y, their view is one extreme view of healer and balance is needed. Bully for you. But then your bias is already well documented. > BTW I think Stephen is already assigned to the healer project. Stephen's feeble attempts to fix Healer were politely thrown in the rubbish bin where they belonged. So don't flog that dead horse. Even a Rank 20 Healer shouldn't be able to resurrect that one. > Again you definately need a couple of predominantly healer characters on the > team making changes or you'll screw up too many things. Complete crap, but then what else do you expect from Bart. It just requires a few sensible people with no axes to grind and a lot of work. And I remain to be convinced that it's even necessary. Hugs and kisses, MTB --------------2E5318B95C156E161AECDB2C Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Since we have started with the mud slinging again. Here's mine.

Bart Janssen wrote:

>>I personally do not agree with Andrew L and Mike Y, their view is one extreme view of healer and balance is needed.
 

Bully for you. But then your bias is already well documented.
 
 

BTW I think Stephen is already assigned to the healer project.
Stephen's feeble attempts to fix Healer were politely thrown in the rubbish bin where they belonged. So don't flog that dead horse. Even a Rank 20 Healer shouldn't be able to resurrect that one.
 
 
Again you definately need a couple of predominantly healer characters on the team making changes or you'll screw up too many things.
Complete crap, but then what else do you expect from Bart. It just requires a few sensible people with no axes to grind and a lot of work. And I remain to be convinced that it's even necessary. 

Hugs and kisses,
MTB --------------2E5318B95C156E161AECDB2C-- -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 18:06:49 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id SAA20997; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 18:06:49 +1300 Received: from mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (mailhost.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.1.4]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id SAA20988 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 18:06:47 +1300 Received: from sci4 (lbr-122-42.lbrsc.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.122.42]) by mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (8.9.1/8.9.1/8.9.1-ua) with SMTP id RAA14089 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 17:55:10 +1300 (NZDT) Message-Id: <199811180455.RAA14089@mailhost.auckland.ac.nz> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 17:58:57 +0000 Subject: RE: Healer X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) From: "Michael Parkinson" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-to: m.parkinson@auckland.ac.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Dear All The myriad of formulae still seem too complex. Concerning the Time aspect, there are two key points, made by others: #1 Healers waste too much time healing party-members #2 The patient *should* spend a lengthy time recovering e.g. > Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 14:40:11 +1300 > From: Martin Dickson > One thing that I have played around with -- and am in favour of -- is > keeping the time to heal the same but decreasing the amount of > contiguous time that the _healer_ has to do it for. That said, I think the game benefits if the patient is merely wounded rather than totally unfit. Likewise Jim hits the nail squarely on the head [just don't ask whose] when he says > Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 15:04:25 +1300 > From: "Jim Arona" > I think that your point about Healing taking ages is, on the one hand, > good, because it means that players are going to spend a lot of time > limping around, and generally suffering, and bad on the other hand, > because it takes out the Healer character for the healing time as well, > is well made, Martin. I pretty much agree with you. [...] #3: A plethora of healers Frankly I dislike the concept of a team of healers working on the one patient -- it is, again, too modernistic. The healer should be surrounded by the sick & injured, not vice versa. I prefer only 1 healer (although a coterie of disciples ise an acceptible accessory). If the patient *is* to be outnumbered, let it be by an excess of wailing kinsfolk and servants instead of by healers. #4: The recovery process On the other aspects, however, I would caution against the following perceptions because they are too modern. > My impression of healing is that the best time to do it is as soon > after the injury as possible, This is true in real life; but I would rather ignore it in game terms -- if we must use a modern perception might I suggest instead that "You can't heal a patient who's not ready to be healed". > and to go through until the subject is stable. Until the patient is > stable, you can't really stop and start. Again this is true, but don't let the facts prevent us from doing what's dramatic. I would prefer the more fantastic or Action-story option that allows a temporary patch-up so that our hero can carry on on bloody stumps to complete the job (at any cost) -- Indeed many "real" heroes don't actually hit their peak until they've lost at least a pint of blood & boken a few bones (both theirs & the foes'). > Once the patient is stable, then you have to spend time correcting > whatever is wrong. That, also, is not a stop/start affair. Again true, but not necessarily desirable. Keith's point: > Personally I don't think the Healer has to spend continuous time with > their patient, but just enough to 'keep an eye on things'. has some validity and application to our game. Indeed enjoyable fanatasy or historical fiction often show that the skill of the healer is only needed a few time. Initially, and at "crises" during the recovery process. NB: these crises are not randomly spaced traumatic events, but an *expected* roughly episodic series of veils or trials that the patient must endure #5: Magic. Concerning Nostrums, ritual recitations, and the like, Stephen replied: > This doesn't have to be in the rules for a Healer to require it of > their patients :}. Nothing is a requirement if it can be ignored without any consequences. What I had in mind was conditions that were an intrinsic part of the recovery. The exact details don't matter; for it to work it would be like a geas. The healer must think it is what their patient *should* do (in accordance with the healer's own precepts and ethics); and the patient *accepts* thosee conditions as part of the magical healing process. Most mages are feared and/or despised; why, in comparison, should healers always be liked unconditionally. I would like to see characters avoiding particular Healers because of the *requirements* or conditions on healing -- e.g, fearing Priestess Lileth because she insist they sacrifice a black-goat to Ashtoreth every morning for a week in blood-curdling rites; or despising Friar Bruno becasue he insists that they are considerate to the poor until the sores go away. Arguably, as a bonus way for the GM to torture the PC, like anything ritualistic, we *could* decree such healing doesn't work AT ALL if you subsequently break-off part way through -- but I would prefer the following sequence: 1: Player gets seriously injured doing something stupid (e.g., stopping a sword with their head). 2: Healer examines patient (or a sympathetic go-between, in some cultures) and performs a short ritual over the patient. 3: Patient immediately feels *much* better, but is still a little injured. They are capable of most tasks, but are not at full strength. 4: Healer, having proved their potency, lectures patient and imposes some quasi-magic ritual to be performed during the recovery period (say 15-rank days, or whatever). 5: Patient progresses gradually and continously to full health over the recovery period -- unless the quasi-ritual is abandoned (at which point the patient will not recover the remaning measure of full health until they see a healer again, OR the wound heals mundanely over time) Regards, Michael Michael Parkinson Assistant Librarian Email: m.parkinson@auckland.ac.nz Science Library Phone: (9) 3737 599 x 5858 University of Auckland Fax: (9) 3082 304 -- See message headers to unsubscribe from -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Wed Nov 18 20:57:27 1998 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id UAA21192; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 20:57:27 +1300 Received: from kcbbs.gen.nz (kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.1]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id UAA21183 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 20:57:26 +1300 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by kcbbs.gen.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA05611 ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 20:42:43 +1300 (NZDT) Message-ID: <36525820.C42CA6B2@games.co.nz> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 18:16:17 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Healer Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------EBA7157E0BFB02A44800274C" From: Mike Young To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. --------------EBA7157E0BFB02A44800274C Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Michael Parkinson wrote: > > 1) Cosmetic surgery is removed or reworded > > Cosmetic surgery may be a desirable concept for our game, but it is heavily > polluted with modern overtones. Although I *have* used it in games to > physically alter NPC (& PC) appearances, one *could* argue that healers can > only repair damaged flesh -- thus they can (depending upon level) restore a > lost eye, or remove the scars resulting from injury but that they can't > "repair" an ugly nose because that is what the patient is, intrinsically; it > would be akin to alterring some letters of a particular Individual True > Name. Similarly a healer could not cut away "excess" flesh or wrinkles, > because that is the natural maturation of the individual, not any injury or > sickness. A healer can only prolong life --you need a special magician to > actually make the patient any younger. I pick him. I don't allow cosmetic surgery by Healers. > > 2) Healer is actually easy to read & find things! > > Even if you do nothing else -- please do this Hear, hear. > > 3) The mystical flavour is emphasised - so that people won't talk about > nerves, transplants, reattachment, cosmetic surgery, and worst of all, CPR. > > Agreed. Perhaps we should just stick to Flesh, Bones and Organs. PROVIDED > that we actually also specify *what* bits of a human body are organs, using > traditional concepts. Say Heart -- seat of compassion; Liver -- seat of the > anima; Brain -- seat of the intellect; or what ever [Aristotelians please > correct my errors]. and a couple more, perhaps; Funny but this is kind of what we have at the moment. Bar the concepts flavour...And yes I too detest the modern jargon that gets bandied about with Healer. Of course if they insist on talking about it in that manner you could just rule that their attempts fail until they get the terminology correct..... I kind of like that.....That would keep them on their toes, especially if you applied it across the board....Wicked. > > 4) Currently undefined abilities like stopping bleeding are covered > briefly. > > > > At the same time, healer being more adventurer orientated - less > (50-3xRank hours) abilities? > > I tentatively agree -- A balance needs to be struck between what is dramatic > (why have a good fight if everybody is uneffected a few minuts later) and > what is practical (As GM you want the party to progress). One *game* > problem with being wounded is that the GM is sometimes forcing one player > (the Healer's player, if not the patient's) to do almost nothing for 30-odd > hours of game time -- I've tried it, its boring. > > I see nothing wrong with a "walking wounded" category. E.g., Paitent can be > *mostly* healed of their damage, say all but -1pt Endurance for every > endurance blow they took, and that last bit of endurance is recovered > "naturally". If the healing can be split up and is not continuous, nor require the constant attention of a/the Healer then many of the preceived problems go away or are at least deminished. I have never found the long times involved to be that much of a problem. As the GM you get to decide how much of a problem the injury is. If the patient is conscious then they get to contribute even in if a reduced fashion. Death or unconsciousness can get pretty boring, but its up to the GM AND THE OTHER PLAYERS TO MINIMIZE THE REAL TIME it takes to bring the injured/dead character back into the game, even if in a reduced capacity. But I agree there needs to be a balance between the dramatic and the practical. If this aspect of Healer is addressed then a major rewrite is not required. I think a workshop could do this in an afternoon. > Also because healing is magical [or quasi-magical], why not emphasise the > Nostrums. E.g., patient is mostly cured (as in preceeding paragraph), but > every morning and evening until restored to full health they must: ritually > bathe; or spend half-an-hour in prayer to Raphael; or recite a specific > magical formula 7 times;or perform an act of contrition; feasting on a > particular diet; or whatever -- according to the cult or collegium of the > healer. Most of this idea is a player flavour thing and already easily within the scope of the current rules. Regards, Michael Young --------------EBA7157E0BFB02A44800274C Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit  

Michael Parkinson wrote:

> 1) Cosmetic surgery is removed or reworded

Cosmetic surgery may be a desirable concept for our game, but it is heavily polluted with modern overtones.  Although I *have* used it in games to physically alter NPC (& PC)  appearances, one *could* argue that healers can only repair damaged flesh -- thus they can (depending upon level) restore a lost eye, or remove the scars resulting from injury but that they can't "repair" an ugly nose because that is what the patient is, intrinsically; it would be akin to alterring some letters of a particular Individual True Name.   Similarly a healer could not cut away "excess" flesh or wrinkles, because that is the natural maturation of the individual, not any injury or sickness.  A healer can only prolong life --you need a special magician to actually make the patient any younger.

I pick him. I don't allow cosmetic surgery by Healers.
 
 
> 2) Healer is actually easy to read & find things!

Even if you do nothing else -- please do this

Hear, hear.
 
 
> 3) The mystical flavour is emphasised - so that people won't talk about nerves, transplants, reattachment, cosmetic surgery, and worst of all, CPR.

Agreed.  Perhaps we should just stick to Flesh, Bones and Organs. PROVIDED that we actually also specify *what* bits of a human body are organs, using traditional concepts.  Say Heart -- seat of compassion; Liver -- seat of the anima; Brain -- seat of the intellect; or what ever [Aristotelians please correct my errors]. and a couple more, perhaps;

Funny but this is kind of what we have at the moment. Bar the concepts flavour...And yes I too detest the modern jargon that gets bandied about with Healer. Of course if they insist on talking about it in that manner you could just rule that their attempts fail until they get the terminology correct.....
I kind of like that.....That would keep them on their toes, especially if you applied it across the board....Wicked.
 
 
 
> 4) Currently undefined abilities like stopping bleeding are covered briefly.
>
> At the same time, healer being more adventurer orientated - less (50-3xRank hours) abilities?

I tentatively agree -- A balance needs to be struck between what is dramatic (why have a good fight if everybody is uneffected a few minuts later) and what is practical (As GM you want the party to progress).  One *game* problem with being wounded is that the GM is sometimes forcing one player (the Healer's player, if not the patient's) to do almost nothing for 30-odd hours of game time  -- I've tried it, its boring.

I see nothing wrong with a "walking wounded" category.  E.g., Paitent can be *mostly* healed of their damage, say all but -1pt Endurance for every endurance blow they took, and that last bit of endurance is recovered "naturally".

If the healing can be split up and is not continuous, nor require the constant attention of a/the Healer then many of the preceived problems go away or are at least deminished. I have never found the long times involved to be that much of a problem. As the GM you get to decide how much of a problem the injury is. If the patient is conscious then they get to contribute even in if a reduced fashion. Death or unconsciousness can get pretty boring, but its up to the GM AND THE OTHER PLAYERS TO MINIMIZE THE REAL TIME it takes to bring the injured/dead character back into the game, even if in a reduced capacity. But I agree there needs to be a balance between the dramatic and the practical. If this aspect of Healer is addressed then a major rewrite is not required. I think a workshop could do this in an afternoon.
 
 
Also because healing is magical [or quasi-magical], why not emphasise the Nostrums.  E.g., patient is mostly cured (as in preceeding paragraph), but every morning and evening until restored to full health they must: ritually bathe; or spend half-an-hour in prayer to Raphael; or recite a specific magical formula 7 times;or perform an act of contrition; feasting on a particular diet; or whatever  -- according to the cult or collegium of the healer.
Most of this idea is a player flavour thing and already easily within the scope of the current rules.
 
 

Regards,
Michael Young --------------EBA7157E0BFB02A44800274C-- -- See message headers to unsubscribe from --