From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 08:17:03 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id IAA14873; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:17:03 +1300 Received: from fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz ([203.98.14.148] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id IAA14870 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:17:02 +1300 Received: from falaklnt000.falum.co.nz ([10.8.1.20]) by fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.1 release 219 ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id nz for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:15:12 +1300 Received: by falaklnt000.falum.co.nz with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62) id <01BE5985.1B6997E0@falaklnt000.falum.co.nz>; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 20:19:43 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: RE: New Spell Prices Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 20:19:42 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Obviously I'm not as clever as I say, 'cos I didn't understand exactly what the point was either. I also have no idea how spells are balanced, but I've been told that they aren't supposed to be 100% balanced, and that is one of the few things we have succeeded at. EM is a measure of how easily you get good at a spell; this makes it somewhat proportional to how good the spell is, and is our best single measure. However, there is no accurate measure of how tough a spell is except the fear in player's faces. This is why a formula for spell prices will always be troublesome. Andrew ---------- From: Ian Wood & Ellen Hume [SMTP:adara@ihug.co.nz] Sent: Monday, 15 February 1999 20:22 To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Subject: RE: New Spell Prices I am still unsure of this, can some one please clarify a point for me. are we trying to stop some mega-spells entering the game early? Or are we trying to stop players from fulfilling their characterisation of their PC? On another point, can someone, say like Andrew because he is clever (he told me so), explain how spells are balanced? Is is a mix of base chance, damage, number of targets and EM? cheers, Ian -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 08:31:44 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id IAA14902; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:31:44 +1300 Received: from fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz ([203.98.14.148] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id IAA14899 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:31:43 +1300 Received: from falaklnt000.falum.co.nz ([10.8.1.20]) by fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.1 release 219 ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id nz for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:29:53 +1300 Received: by falaklnt000.falum.co.nz with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62) id <01BE5987.283F32C0@falaklnt000.falum.co.nz>; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 20:34:24 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: RE: 42 Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 20:34:23 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz We have a campaign group of three, that significant shared campaign stuff (maps, gazetteer, y2k, EJ, etc) goes through. Why not have a rules gang of four that does the same thing? Then GMs can get on with running games and developing rich plot lines to entertain. A few people can get their jollies tidying up the rules & making them more consistent or variable, with more or less detail, and available for those awkward rule interpretations when a GM doesn't know/mind which way to rule to further their plot. Gods meetings can be more campaign focused, with less rules content, just reports back from the gang & acceptance/rejection/guidance on their ideas. When someone gets pissed off from too many of their ideas being biffed, they quit and someone else volunteers. This would lead to a certain polish and consistency of presentation, even if others came up with many of the ideas. Main draw-back, do we have four volunteers who most GMs trust collectively to touch the rules? And can we leave people to get on with the job? Andrew ---------- I tend to agree with you that most of the rule changes of late are minor and the bigger issues (whatever they are) often don't get addressed. What we really need is 3-5 Rules Nazi's who write the rules and the rest of you just get to play them with only minor imput. But somehow I don't see this happening. Michael Young -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 08:53:46 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id IAA14942; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:53:46 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id IAA14939 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:53:45 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p59-max24.akl.ihug.co.nz [207.212.240.251]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA09453 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:52:25 +1300 Message-Id: <199902151952.IAA09453@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: 42 Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:45:42 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz ---------- > From: Andrew Withy (FAL AKL) > > > Why not have a rules gang of four that does the same thing? > > Main draw-back, do we have four volunteers who most GMs trust > collectively to touch the rules? And can we leave people to get on > with the job? I don't think that this is acheivable or even desirable. I think that it's the wrong approach to take. What we ought to be doing is educating players in being more flexible about playing under different DMs, not make the game rules consistent. Jim. -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 09:07:44 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id JAA14965; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:07:44 +1300 Received: from smtp.worley.co.nz (fwuser@fw.worley.co.nz [202.135.112.130]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id JAA14962 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:07:43 +1300 Received: by smtp.worley.co.nz(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.1 (569.2 2-6-1998)) id 4C256719.00742804 ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:08:44 +1200 X-Lotus-FromDomain: WORLEY CONSULTANTS Message-ID: <4C256719.0073B684.00@smtp.worley.co.nz> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:06:23 +1200 Subject: Re: 42 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline From: amtennant@worley.co.nz To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz >> The reasoning for this is that if the players do not get along on a game then >> the game tends to be ruined for all players. Not everyone will happily get >> along but getting a few more people to be able to enjoy their roleplaying >> seems like a good plan. I have seen 4-5 unhappy players who either did not >> enjoy games due to other players or have left DQ due to bad games. >Really Mandos? And can you actually tell us who these people are? Because a >number of times someone has claimed that DQ is losing players due to other >players/bad GM's/silly rules etc. But when pressed no one can actually give me >an example of this. Sure we lost Bart recently but then who cares? Reid falls into this category. I could name others but I'm not so sure of their reasons for leaving. L8R, Adam. -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 10:27:36 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA15080; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:27:36 +1300 Received: from peace.com (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id KAA15077 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:27:34 +1300 Received: via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/pcnz2.7) id PAA24507; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 15:10:57 +1300 Message-ID: <36C78491.752BE403@peace.com> Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 15:21:05 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Style? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Mandos Mitchinson wrote: > >People don't leave the game because they're upset with it, George. They > >leave because they're bored with it. Every move that takes us away from > >tedium is a step towards getting more players. > > That is an exceedingly erronious statement. Most of the people I know who > have left DQ have left due to the nature of the game and those who play it. > I don't think I know of a player that has left due to boredom. People leave for any number of reasons; they move away, change jobs, get older and have kids, they find that their spare time is finite and other things fill it. However that said, I am more personally aware of those who have left through annoyance than boredom... though perhaps ennui is a better description than anger. The same wranglings endlessly repeated take their toll. - Martin -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 10:27:47 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA15085; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:27:47 +1300 Received: from peace.com (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id KAA15082 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:27:46 +1300 Received: via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/pcnz2.7) id LAA09862; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 11:23:35 +1300 Message-ID: <36C74F48.1F3F85A3@peace.com> Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 11:33:44 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: New Spell Prices Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" wrote: > Just a note: The costs for EM x days are 7 times lower than they > should be (shown as EM x weeks). This distorts the graph somewhat. I'm > still keen on this instead of EM x 20 - it makes high-EM spells more > expensive. For the mathematically challenged amongst us (or for those who just weren't paying attention), what does the (EM x days) formula mean? EM x days (to learn), or something else? And does this make high EM spells more expensive because EM is already? built in to the days I would be keen to see a revised graph showing the correct line for this formula... (sorry with the non-linear SP axis I just can't visualise it). > From: rmansfield@aj.co.nz [SMTP:rmansfield@aj.co.nz] > My preferred proposal is: > A) Spell prices are calculated at em x 20 > B) The only exception is Investment which remains at 100,000 (as it > generates money for characters out of play rather than costing them > money). > C) EM for rank 0 is treated as a separate issue. B may indeed need to be treated as a special case. There may be other special cases too. As a side note, the Wicca prices (when set by me) were set a little higher than the average for the "in game" reason that Wicca is not taught by the guild but rather by a coven with an arrangement with the guild and felt that the surcharge was justified... or course such special cases would seriously interfere with getting a unified pricing structure. Personally I find that the EX x 20 formula make spells up to 300 EM or so about right, but makes the very tough ones way too cheap. All those nasty 500-600 EM ones end up in the 10k-12k area, or about 1/3 to 1/4 of where I would like to see them. Unfortunately a formula of EM x 60 or so (which gives OK prices at the top end) then makes 100-200EM spells unreasonably expensive. Cheers, Martin -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 10:29:02 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA15096; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:29:02 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id KAA15093 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:29:01 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p59-max24.akl.ihug.co.nz [207.212.240.251]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA20353 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:27:38 +1300 Message-Id: <199902152127.KAA20353@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: 42 Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:23:55 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz ---------- > From: amtennant@worley.co.nz MTB wrote: > >Really Mandos? And can you actually tell us who these people are? Because > a > >number of times someone has claimed that DQ is losing players due to other > >players/bad GM's/silly rules etc. But when pressed no one can actually > give me > >an example of this. Sure we lost Bart recently but then who cares? > > Reid falls into this category. > > I could name others but I'm not so sure of their reasons for leaving. > Reid Pittams left because he was annoyed with change, or because he was bored? Which? Jim. -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 10:35:02 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA15134; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:35:02 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id KAA15130 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:35:00 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p59-max24.akl.ihug.co.nz [207.212.240.251]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA20937 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:33:37 +1300 Message-Id: <199902152133.KAA20937@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: 42 Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:29:59 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz ---------- > From: Andrew Withy (FAL AKL) > > Why not have a rules gang of four that does the same thing? Then GMs > can get on with running games and developing rich plot lines to > entertain. I don't think DMing happens this exclusively. I think that a DM makes adjustments to the game so that it creates the effects they're looking for. Therefore, they need to have a pretty free hand with the rules, in general. The most effective thing we could do to improve the game would be to teach players that the rules are not the game, as the map is not the territory. They are a guide, only, and a DM may choose to play or not play a rule the way the player would like. It is better for the player to either play within the DMs constraints of the game, or play in another game, if they can't derive enjoyment from it. Instead, we have the attitude that the player is this frail, delicate thing, who must be fostered like a delicate orchid. Instead, players should be a lot more robust, and take up the challenge that playing in a game where the world can alter beneath their feet from time to time. It is, after all, a magical world. Jim. -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 10:58:07 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA15198; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:58:07 +1300 Received: from peace.com (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id KAA15195 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:58:05 +1300 Received: via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/pcnz2.7) id KAA00490; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:56:43 +1300 Message-ID: <36C89A7F.66416D88@peace.co.nz> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 11:06:55 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Style? Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------80799D9B03C552F4B0887FE0" From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------80799D9B03C552F4B0887FE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ian Wood wrote: > Two examples of roleplaying spring to mind: > > A PC enters a bar and asks the barman for directions. > > A PC enters a bar and strikes at a customer with a sword. > > In the lower level games I have played in, the asking of the directions is usually vocalised, IE the player must speak teh exact words, get the intonation correct for the PC and react as per the characterisation of the PC. (some would call this boring, and can be irritating if over done) > > In every game of any level, however, I would only have to state the sword strike, and roll some dice.... > > [snip] > > Both are, demonstrably, roleplaying. Hi Ian, You are quite right, and when, some time ago, I wrote that the split was Roleplay vs. Gaming I was probably revealing my own personal prejudices. Action gaming is also roleplaying... whether one says "I'll whack 'im with my sword", or even "The Elf will whack 'im with his sword" -- the latter case being more likely in the RPGs of days of yore. Technically at the far end of the spectrum Doom and Quake and their ilk are roleplaying -- in that you are playing a role -- that of a psychotic marine -- and even getting to see through your character's eyes, which is pretty neat. There is very limited characterization in this, or really none -- which is why the role would be ideal for Van Damme if they ever make a Doom movie). . At the other end there is theater-sports and psycho-drama... pure acting or characterisation with no gaming. Part of the reason for the change in emphasis on characterisation from low to high level is PC competence. Actions that may be considered interesting or challenging for low level PCs may be considered mundane for high levels, and indeed in this way the characters may be given a feeling of their worth. Bob the Weed may be given a hard time by a narky barman, the same barman isn't going to say boo to Lord Blitz. The same journey that may prove challenging for a low party, and involve detailed dealings with natives and brigands, might be covered swiftly the GM of a high party: "You travel north for five days. The journey is uneventful save for an encounter with some unfortunate bandits". However, once the high party arrive in the feasting hall of Mad Duke Otto and are attempting to argue for their lives, characterisation should once again play a major part. The party are treating with a peer. :) Cheers, Martin --------------80799D9B03C552F4B0887FE0 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="martin.dickson.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Martin Dickson Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="martin.dickson.vcf" begin:vcard n:Dickson;Martin tel;fax:+64-9-373 0401 tel;work:+64-9-373 0400 x-mozilla-html:FALSE org:Peace Software International;Software Development version:2.1 email;internet:martin.dickson@peace.com title:Team Leader adr;quoted-printable:;;Peace Tower =0D=0ASt. Martins Lane;Auckland;;;New Zealand fn:Martin Dickson end:vcard --------------80799D9B03C552F4B0887FE0-- -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 10:58:53 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA15206; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:58:53 +1300 Received: from fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz ([203.98.14.148] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id KAA15203 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:58:52 +1300 Received: from falaklnt000.falum.co.nz ([10.8.1.20]) by fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.1 release 219 ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id nz for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:57:01 +1300 Received: by falaklnt000.falum.co.nz with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62) id <01BE599B.B5A56170@falaklnt000.falum.co.nz>; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 23:01:31 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: FW: DQPA Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 23:01:30 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq-announce@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq-announce@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz For those of you who haven't stumbled across it yet, the DQ Players Association apparently has some interesting campaign & rules discussions in-between the in-character crap. Andrew ---------- From: jcarcutt [SMTP:jcarcutt@desire.wright.edu] Sent: Tuesday, 16 February 1999 9:32 To: Andrew Withy (FAL AKL) Subject: DQPA We are using the WebRPG board as our main discussion forum right now and you can find many threads on various ways to improve the current game rules. There have been discussions on everything from revamping the college of Illusions, to changing the skill system to more resemble the magic system. The discussions can be quite lively at times. I am sure everyone would enjoy additional input, if you have the time: http://townhall.webrpg.com/index.phtml?groupid=59 -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 11:52:40 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id LAA15352; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 11:52:40 +1300 Received: from smtp.worley.co.nz (fwuser@fw.worley.co.nz [202.135.112.130]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id LAA15349 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 11:52:37 +1300 Received: by smtp.worley.co.nz(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.1 (569.2 2-6-1998)) id 4C256719.008340D7 ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 11:53:38 +1200 X-Lotus-FromDomain: WORLEY CONSULTANTS Message-ID: <4C256719.0082443E.00@smtp.worley.co.nz> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 11:48:52 +1200 Subject: Re: 42 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline From: amtennant@worley.co.nz To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz >>Really Mandos? And can you actually tell us who these people are? >>Because a >>number of times someone has claimed that DQ is losing players due to >>other >>players/bad GM's/silly rules etc. But when pressed no one can actually >give me >an example of this. Sure we lost Bart recently but then who cares? > Reid falls into this category. > > I could name others but I'm not so sure of their reasons for leaving. >Reid Pittams left because he was annoyed with change, or because he was >bored? Which? I think he left because of a combination of the above, i.e. other players, bad GMs and silly rules but also time restraints etc.... I'm not sure you could point at one thing and I'm pretty sure there isn't a way of fixing things so this doesn't happen. Some people just have enough and leave. I don't think there's a case for us trying to fix things to stop people leaving, but on the other hand I have noticed that it seems like there are fewer people playing these days. This may just be, as Jim points out, that a lot of adventures are being organised privately. L8R, Adam. -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 12:46:50 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id MAA15402; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:46:50 +1300 Received: from fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz ([203.98.14.148] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id MAA15399 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:46:47 +1300 Received: from falaklnt000.falum.co.nz ([10.8.1.20]) by fclaklmr01.fcl.co.nz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.1 release 219 ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id nz for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:44:48 +1300 Received: by falaklnt000.falum.co.nz with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62) id <01BE59AA.C5433120@falaklnt000.falum.co.nz>; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 00:49:20 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: RE: 42 Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 00:49:18 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz On the other hand, our recruitment from University has decreased in the last couple of years. Jim mentioned it being quiet because of exams. I don't think this is so any more. Would we have more than 5 university/tech students playing? This might be the problem, possibly linked to a lack of recruitment, or because White Wolf is the in-thing, with the America live-roleplaying, which seems to have a lot of life and a campaign with depth and breadth. Long-term roleplayers don't need to turn to us for that sort of longevity - they have it already. Andrew ---------- I don't think there's a case for us trying to fix things to stop people leaving, but on the other hand I have noticed that it seems like there are fewer people playing these days. This may just be, as Jim points out, that a lot of adventures are being organised privately. L8R, Adam. -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 12:57:09 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id MAA15422; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:57:09 +1300 Received: from bo.nznet.gen.nz (ns1.nznet.gen.nz [203.167.232.34]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id MAA15419 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:57:08 +1300 Received: from takitimu.co.nz (ms2-19.nznet.gen.nz [203.167.232.149]) by bo.nznet.gen.nz (8.8.7/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA32284 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:55:02 +1300 Received: from takitimu.co.nz by takitimu.co.nz; Tue, 16 Feb 99 10:38:59 +1300 Message-ID: <36C894B3.97278742@takitimu.co.nz> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:42:16 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Bardic College Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Kelsie To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: kelsie@takitimu.co.nz, dq@dq.sf.org.nz > [Jacqui Wrote] > > >I tend to consider emotions more the province of Mind mages, and define the > >province of Bards as music, sound and communication. I can see no reason to > >disallow the magical manipulation of sound, and if any College is capable > >of performing sound magic, it is the Bardic College. > > While I agree that Bardic would certainly contain sound magic, and be > a college skilled in the magical manipulation of sound, I would think > that these sound based spells should all be "originating" from the mage. > > To clarify that - it is a performance based college - that's what bards > do, > so while sound based magic such as the Great Shout spell fits with this > performance aspect (The mage projects something), doing wierd things > with > what the mage hears doesn't fit the feel I have for the college. > > I don't know - can talented musicians from the real world, navigate any > better in the dark because of their talent? A vaguely silly argument, > I admit, given this is magic we are talking about, but something about > a Bardic mage using echoes, really doesn't sit straight. > The discussion on the techie aspects of bardic, specifically the echovision (but I'd also include the cone of silence off the top of my head) seems be trying to convince Jacqui that it shouldn't be there when thats not whats really needed. What we need is a show of hands of who DOES think it should be there, cos it only seems to be Jacqui so far. Kelsie -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 13:17:06 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id NAA15449; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 13:17:06 +1300 Received: from bo.nznet.gen.nz (ns1.nznet.gen.nz [203.167.232.34]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id NAA15446 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 13:17:04 +1300 Received: from takitimu.co.nz (ms2-17.nznet.gen.nz [203.167.232.147]) by bo.nznet.gen.nz (8.8.7/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA02041 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 13:15:00 +1300 Received: from takitimu.co.nz by takitimu.co.nz; Tue, 16 Feb 99 13:13:36 +1300 Message-ID: <36C8B906.B413ED6D@takitimu.co.nz> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 13:17:26 +1300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [Fwd: Bardic College] Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------F15A4A853B160E8E1D29D6D7" From: Kelsie To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: kelsie@takitimu.co.nz, dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------F15A4A853B160E8E1D29D6D7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --------------F15A4A853B160E8E1D29D6D7 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 Message-ID: <36C894B3.97278742@takitimu.co.nz> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:42:16 +1300 From: Kelsie Reply-To: kelsie@takitimu.co.nz Organization: Takitimu X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Subject: Re: Bardic College References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > [Jacqui Wrote] > > >I tend to consider emotions more the province of Mind mages, and define the > >province of Bards as music, sound and communication. I can see no reason to > >disallow the magical manipulation of sound, and if any College is capable > >of performing sound magic, it is the Bardic College. > > While I agree that Bardic would certainly contain sound magic, and be > a college skilled in the magical manipulation of sound, I would think > that these sound based spells should all be "originating" from the mage. > > To clarify that - it is a performance based college - that's what bards > do, > so while sound based magic such as the Great Shout spell fits with this > performance aspect (The mage projects something), doing wierd things > with > what the mage hears doesn't fit the feel I have for the college. > > I don't know - can talented musicians from the real world, navigate any > better in the dark because of their talent? A vaguely silly argument, > I admit, given this is magic we are talking about, but something about > a Bardic mage using echoes, really doesn't sit straight. > The discussion on the techie aspects of bardic, specifically the echovision (but I'd also include the cone of silence off the top of my head) seems be trying to convince Jacqui that it shouldn't be there when thats not whats really needed. What we need is a show of hands of who DOES think it should be there, cos it only seems to be Jacqui so far. Kelsie --------------F15A4A853B160E8E1D29D6D7-- -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue Feb 16 20:06:40 1999 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id UAA15744; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:06:40 +1300 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id UAA15741 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:06:39 +1300 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p15-max41.akl.ihug.co.nz [209.79.137.143]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA14903 for ; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:05:02 +1300 Message-Id: <199902160705.UAA14903@smtp1.ihug.co.nz> Subject: Re: Martin's email address Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:01:20 +1300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a message to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Martin, what is your email address. All of the mail I send to you keeps being bounced. Jim. -- see unsubscribe instructions in message headers --