From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 02:41:30 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id CAA15875; Tue, 30 May 2000 02:32:47 +1200 Received: from smtp2.ihug.co.nz (smtp2.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.8]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id CAA15872 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 02:32:43 +1200 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p31-tnt6.akl.ihug.co.nz [216.100.154.31]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id CAA16901 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 02:21:21 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 02:20:17 +1200 Message-ID: <01bfc979$034d8120$1f9a64d8@jimarona.ihug.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Subject: Re: Gods Meeting Agenda 4/6/00 From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Ian Wood wrote: >Ressurection: I would prefer it to state that 'modifications' may not be faithfully represented in the >resurrected body. >secondly I would like see clarified if the spirit can be resurrected into another body. (weird out of body >fetishes look out!) >thirdly: I see no need for the 'malignant phantasm' (I am yet to meet a nice one), just say the healer looses >(blah) amount of damage (grevious injury would be excellent) This is supposed to be a reduction of the Healer's EN value, not a temporary reduction. The Healer loses that amount of EN permanently. Jim. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 08:11:28 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id IAA17700; Tue, 30 May 2000 08:03:55 +1200 Received: from smtp2.ihug.co.nz (smtp2.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.8]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id IAA17697 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 08:03:51 +1200 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p115-tnt2.akl.ihug.co.nz [203.109.245.115]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id HAA27443 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 07:52:21 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 07:51:08 +1200 Message-ID: <01bfc9a7$3bd995a0$73f56dcb@jimarona.ihug.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Subject: Re: Amulets of Jade for Sale From: "Jim Arona" To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz >I am selling 5 amulets of Jade on behalf of >Sharlin. > >Price is 7000sp each > >Contact Kishwa at the guild. Father Rowan, SC, Hand of Mercy, Balm to the Afflicted, offers his amulets of Jade at a price of 4,000sp to adventurers of firm character and just mien. Adventurers of more dubious antecedents can pay 4,800sp for the privilege of owning one of these essential accessories. And, adventurers whose traffickings with the darkest pits of Tartarus have blackened the shriveled remains of their souls can just sod off, at whatever price they care to offer me... Rowan Velcanthus, SC, yadda yadda yadda.... p.s.Trafficking with the darkest pits of Tartarus means you, Kishwa or Sharlin. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 08:56:41 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id IAA18023; Tue, 30 May 2000 08:55:29 +1200 Received: from akl-notes.aj.co.nz (ns.aj.co.nz [202.27.194.165]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id IAA18020 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 08:55:24 +1200 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 08:42:17 +1200 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on akl-notes.aj.co.nz/AJNzl/NZ(Release 5.0.3 (Intl)|21 March 2000) at 30/05/2000 08:42:15, Serialize complete at 30/05/2000 08:42:15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 00742D06CC2568EE_=" Subject: RE: Healer & Cantrips From: RMansfield@aj.co.nz To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 00742D06CC2568EE_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Thanks for you comments Ian. Here's my thoughts on your feedback. Rosemary Dear All, Healer seems ok, though I wonder about the high base changes (I like the idea of failures - inflict permanent damage for each fail = PCs should fear injury, and the Healer ) specifically: The base chances have always been 90 + rank. This is the 'all skills maximum when no base chance specified' It's just never said so. In general: I would prefer just give the rules and the results, rather than justification = gets in the way, and my worlds operate how I want, but still give the same results. Resurrection: I would prefer it to state that 'modifications' may not be faithfully represented in the resurrected body. Point 5 says 'The healer need not know what the patient looked like since the healing of the body is governed by its own genetics (or aura, if you prefer). Hence any changes that had been made to the body (for example facial changes or embedded items) will be gone after the resurrection.' secondly I would like see clarified if the spirit can be resurrected into another body. (weird out of body fetishes look out!) This would require a rule change - sorry not in this version thirdly: I see no need for the 'malignant phantasm' (I am yet to meet a nice one), just say the healer looses (blah) amount of damage (grievous injury would be excellent) This has always been in the rules, though I've only heard of it happening once. 4: What endurance is reduced by one when the resurrection fails? Endurance characteristic, like for a successful resurrection? Otherwise it makes little sense to me, as we can go to negative 1/2 Max END before death, so the PC suddenly needs to have positive END. I'll add the word characteristic, thanks I missed this one. 5: the resurrected have 1 END, with the rest the equivalent of grievous injury damage, which may only be 'cured by a healer, magic or allowing the body to recover naturally'. We currently have rules on the recovery of END lost to grievous injury - perhaps you should just refer to the section? This is to make it quite clear that it's nothing to do with the 1 point lost above. Regeneration: I assume it takes 15-rank days per organ to be fixed? It says to treat each organ as a separate regeneration and that each regeneration takes 15-rank days. That's what it says..is the Adventuring rules seem a bit incongruous: The times for healing have confused me. Does grievous injury recover naturally (IE just rest and wait 3 days per point) or require the intervention of a healer ? Can healing spells and potions fix grievous injury? The paragraph you are looking for is: Grievous Injuries Endurance loss resulting from Specific Grievous injuries may not be healed and will not heal naturally until the underlying specific injury is healed So say you have a spec grev of 'broken arm' which caused you 2 EN damage. You can heal however you like all damage from that combat except those 2 points. Then when the broken arm has healed, either naturally or by a healer, then the 2 EN will heal by whatever means you like. The original writing of this was in 3 places and very wordy so I tried to write once, briefly and clearly. If other people find it confusing I'll re-write it. Cantrips are rather weak, which I believe is the point. Still would have thought some utility stuff should be achievable, for higher fatigue costs. Perhaps you could describe these as the standard or basic Cantrips. This would allow some small magics to be awarded as treasure, without major new spells being introduced. I am aware of several PCs who have cantrips which are more powerful than those described. I would try to include these possibilities. I completely disagree. The whole complaint about cantrips is that they are too strong for freebees that don't require EP. What those players have is special spells. cheers Ian --=_alternative 00742D06CC2568EE_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Thanks for you comments Ian.  Here's my thoughts on your feedback.
Rosemary


Dear All,

Healer seems ok, though I wonder about the high base changes (I like the idea of failures - inflict permanent damage for each fail = PCs should fear injury, and the Healer <grin>)
specifically:
The base chances have always been 90 + rank.  This is the 'all skills maximum when no base chance specified' It's just never said so.

In general: I would prefer just give the rules and the results, rather than justification = gets in the way, and my worlds operate how I want, but still give the same results.

Resurrection: I would prefer it to state that 'modifications' may not be faithfully represented in the resurrected body.
Point 5 says 'The healer need not know what the patient looked like since the healing of the body is governed by its own genetics (or aura, if you prefer). Hence any changes that had been made to the body (for example facial changes or embedded items) will be gone after the resurrection.'

secondly I would like see clarified if the spirit can be resurrected into another body. (weird out of body fetishes look out!)
This would require a rule change - sorry not in this version

thirdly: I see no need for the 'malignant phantasm' (I am yet to meet a nice one), just say the healer looses (blah) amount of damage (grievous injury would be excellent)
This has always been in the rules, though I've only heard of it happening once.

4: What endurance is reduced by one when the resurrection fails? Endurance characteristic, like for a successful resurrection? Otherwise it makes little sense to me, as we can go to negative 1/2 Max END before death, so the PC suddenly needs to have positive END.
I'll add the word characteristic, thanks I missed this one.

5: the resurrected have 1 END, with the rest the equivalent of grievous injury damage, which may only be 'cured by a healer, magic or allowing the body to recover naturally'. We currently have rules on the recovery of END lost to grievous injury - perhaps you should just refer to the section?
This is to make it quite clear that it's nothing to do with the 1 point lost above.
 
Regeneration: I assume it takes 15-rank days per organ to be fixed?
It says to treat each organ as a separate regeneration and that each regeneration takes 15-rank days.  That's what it says..is

the Adventuring rules seem a bit incongruous:
The times for healing have confused me. Does grievous injury recover naturally (IE just rest and wait 3 days per point) or require the intervention of a healer ? Can healing spells and potions fix grievous injury?
The paragraph you are looking for is:
Grievous Injuries
Endurance loss resulting from Specific Grievous injuries may not be healed and will not heal naturally until the underlying specific injury is healed
So say you have a spec grev of 'broken arm' which caused you 2 EN damage. You can heal however you like all damage from that combat except those 2 points.  Then when the  broken arm has healed, either naturally or by a healer, then the 2 EN will heal by whatever means you like. The original writing of this was in 3 places and very wordy so I tried to write once, briefly and clearly.  If other people find it confusing I'll re-write it.

Cantrips are rather weak, which I believe is the point. Still  would have thought some utility stuff should be achievable, for higher fatigue costs. Perhaps you could describe these as the standard or basic Cantrips. This would allow some small magics to be awarded as treasure, without major new spells being introduced. I am aware of several PCs who have cantrips which are more powerful than those described. I would try to include these possibilities.
I completely disagree.  The whole complaint about cantrips is that they are too strong for freebees that don't require EP.  What those players have is special spells.  
cheers Ian

--=_alternative 00742D06CC2568EE_=-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 09:11:51 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id JAA18101; Tue, 30 May 2000 09:02:36 +1200 Received: from akl-notes.aj.co.nz (ns.aj.co.nz [202.27.194.165]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id JAA18098 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 09:02:33 +1200 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 08:49:25 +1200 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on akl-notes.aj.co.nz/AJNzl/NZ(Release 5.0.3 (Intl)|21 March 2000) at 30/05/2000 08:49:23, Serialize complete at 30/05/2000 08:49:23 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 0074D49FCC2568EE_=" Subject: Re Healer From: RMansfield@aj.co.nz To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 0074D49FCC2568EE_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Terry wrote Under the section labelled regeneration a time is specified in the summary, 15 - Rank days. The description suggests a different time, related to the length of the limb - contrary to the summary. There are two types of regeneration - internal organs - which take 15-rank days, and severed body parts which take player's 'x' inches length x days. Rosemary --=_alternative 0074D49FCC2568EE_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Terry wrote
Under the section labelled regeneration a time is specified in the summary,
15 - Rank days. The description suggests a different time, related to the
length of the limb - contrary to the summary.

There are two types of regeneration - internal organs - which take 15-rank days, and severed body parts which take player's 'x' inches length x days.

Rosemary --=_alternative 0074D49FCC2568EE_=-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 09:12:27 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id IAA18056; Tue, 30 May 2000 08:58:44 +1200 Received: from akl-notes.aj.co.nz (ns.aj.co.nz [202.27.194.165]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id IAA18053 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 08:58:41 +1200 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 08:45:33 +1200 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on akl-notes.aj.co.nz/AJNzl/NZ(Release 5.0.3 (Intl)|21 March 2000) at 30/05/2000 08:45:31, Serialize complete at 30/05/2000 08:45:32, Serialize by Router on akl-notes.aj.co.nz/AJNzl/NZ(Release 5.0.3 (Intl)|21 March 2000) at 30/05/2000 08:45:32 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 00747A18CC2568EE_=" Subject: Re: Healer From: RMansfield@aj.co.nz To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 00747A18CC2568EE_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Ian wrote: >thirdly: I see no need for the 'malignant phantasm' (I am yet to meet a nice one), just say the healer looses >(blah) amount of damage (grievous injury would be excellent) Jim Replied This is supposed to be a reduction of the Healer's EN value, not a temporary reduction. The Healer loses that amount of EN permanently. News to me, I always thought it was damage. Can anyone else confirm this? If so I change the wording so it's clearer. Thanks Rosemary --=_alternative 00747A18CC2568EE_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Ian wrote:
>thirdly: I see no need for the 'malignant phantasm' (I am yet to meet a
nice one), just say the healer looses >(blah) amount of damage (grievous
injury would be excellent)
Jim Replied
This is supposed to be a reduction of the Healer's EN value, not a temporary
reduction. The Healer loses that amount of EN permanently.

News to me, I always thought it was damage.  Can anyone else confirm this?
If so I change the wording so it's clearer.

Thanks Rosemary --=_alternative 00747A18CC2568EE_=-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 09:26:31 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id JAA18249; Tue, 30 May 2000 09:18:47 +1200 Received: from fclaklmr02.fcl.co.nz ([202.14.23.202] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id JAA18246 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 09:18:42 +1200 Received: from falaklex00.falum.co.nz (10.8.1.28) by fclaklmr02.fcl.co.nz Tuesday, May 30, 2000 09:03:18 Message-ID: Received: by falaklex00.fcl.co.nz with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Tue, 30 May 2000 09:07:39 +1200 Message-ID: <311B3C3DD32FD311B33900805F770A72010B14FE@falaklex00.fcl.co.nz> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 09:07:38 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9B1.EB58F030" Subject: RE: Healer From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9B1.EB58F030 Content-Type: text/plain I thought the EN was lost permanently. Otherwise the phantasm has no "bite". Its why Namers charge 5,000sp to resurrect. Andrew > -----Original Message----- > Ian wrote: > >thirdly: I see no need for the 'malignant phantasm' (I am yet to meet a > nice one), just say the healer looses >(blah) amount of damage (grievous > injury would be excellent) > > Jim Replied > This is supposed to be a reduction of the Healer's EN value, not a > temporary > reduction. The Healer loses that amount of EN permanently. > > News to me, I always thought it was damage. Can anyone else confirm this? > > If so I change the wording so it's clearer. > > Thanks Rosemary ------_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9B1.EB58F030 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: Healer

I thought the EN was = lost permanently. Otherwise the phantasm has no "bite". Its = why Namers charge 5,000sp to resurrect.

Andrew

    -----Original Message-----
    Ian wrote:
    >thirdly: I see no need = for the 'malignant phantasm' (I am yet to meet a
    nice one), just say the healer looses >(blah) amount of damage = (grievous
    injury would be excellent)

    Jim Replied
    This is supposed to be a reduction of the Healer's EN value, not a = temporary
    reduction. The Healer loses that amount of EN permanently.

    News to me, I always thought it was = damage. =A0Can anyone else confirm this?
    If so I change the wording so it's = clearer.

    Thanks Rosemary

------_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9B1.EB58F030-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 10:11:43 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA18531; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:01:47 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id KAA18528 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:01:44 +1200 Message-ID: <3932E2D2.CAC68415@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 09:36:18 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote:
secondly I would like see clarified if the spirit can be resurrected into another body. (weird out of body fetishes look out!)
This would require a rule change - sorry not in this version
Hi Rosemary,

I'm a bit confused.  The current Healer rules appear to specifically allow for this possibility. Paragraph just after ressurection details:

"If a character’s life-force is placed in another’s body, they retain any magical abilities, the skill Ranks are halved (rounding down) and the combat abilities are those of the previous inhabitant of the body. The temporary union of life-force and body uses the value of the body’s first four characteristics, and the value of the life-force’s characteristics for the remainder."

I don't think these rules are ideal -- having the combat abilities of the previous inhabitant is particularly weird -- but the rules themselves appear fairly clear on the matter.

Cheers,
            Martin

--

 _/_/  Peace Software New Zealand Ltd   Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com
_/     Martin Dickson                   Fax  : +64-9-373-0401
       Analyst                          Phone: +64-9-373-0400
  -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 10:26:31 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA18713; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:20:50 +1200 Received: from smtp4.ihug.co.nz (smtp4.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.5]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id KAA18710 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:20:47 +1200 Received: from user (203-109-144-43.ihug.net [203.109.144.43]) by smtp4.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id KAA24524 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:09:15 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 10:09:15 +1200 Message-Id: <200005292209.KAA24524@smtp4.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: fiona@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: Amulets of Jade for Sale From: "Fiona M.M.Cole" To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz Sir Eidolon Would you care to meet to discuss this decline in morals that has you so concerned? Before you do I would suggest you first refrain from using such filthy language. Lady Dark At 17:38 29/05/00 +1200, you wrote: >F***ing rip-off. There's little old ladies giving them away at the docks for >passage north. > >If you don't trust them, you can get a guaranteed tried & tested jade amulet >on a real gold-plated chain & five evenings of all you can eat - buffet or a >la carte - at the Tar & Feathers brothel for an all inclusive price of >5,000sp (or 6,000 guild scrip). > >Sir Eidolon, Warrior of Light >(Someone has to stop the decline in morals spread by "heroes" such as Lady >Dark and this Kishwa) >> -----Original Message----- >> From: scott whitaker [SMTP:kharsis@ihug.co.nz] >> Sent: Monday, May 29, 2000 4:14 PM >> To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz >> Subject: Amulets of Jade for Sale >> >> I am selling 5 amulets of Jade on behalf of >> Sharlin. >> >> Price is 7000sp each >> >> Contact Kishwa at the guild. >> >> >> >> -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- > > > > > >RE: Amulets of Jade for Sale > > > >

F***ing rip-off. There's little old ladies giving them away at the docks for passage north. >

> >

If you don't trust them, you can get a guaranteed tried & tested jade amulet on a real gold-plated chain & five evenings of all you can eat - buffet or a la carte - at the Tar & Feathers brothel for an all inclusive price of 5,000sp (or 6,000 guild scrip).

> >

Sir Eidolon, Warrior of Light >
(Someone has to stop the decline in morals spread by "heroes" such as Lady Dark and this Kishwa) >

    >

    -----Original Message----- >
    From:   scott whitaker [SMTP:kharsis@ihug.co.nz] >
    Sent:   Monday, May 29, 2000 4:14 PM >
    To:     dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz >
    Subject:        Amulets of Jade for Sale >

    > >

    I am selling 5 amulets of Jade on behalf of >
    Sharlin. >

    > >

    Price is 7000sp each >

    > >

    Contact Kishwa at the guild. >

    >
    >
    > >

    -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- >

    >
> > -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 10:41:41 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA18834; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:40:17 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id KAA18831 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:40:14 +1200 Message-ID: <3932EBD2.87C3EE56@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 10:14:42 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Malignant Phantasm [was Re: Healer] From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz What does the Phantasm do? > Andrew Withy wrote: > I thought the EN was lost permanently. > > Ian wrote: > ...just say the healer looses (blah) amount of damage (grievous injury would be excellent) > > Jim wrote" > This is supposed to be a reduction of the Healer's EN value, not a temporary reduction. The Healer loses that amount of EN > permanently. > > Rosemary wrote: > ...I always thought it was damage. The wording in question form the Healer rules is: "If the roll for resurrection is equal to or greater than (90 + Healer’s Rank), the healer has summoned a malignant phantasm, rather than the patient’s life-force. The phantasm will drain some power from the healer, reducing their Endurance value by [D - 5] (minimum of 1). The phantasm will then return to the nether-world." The wording eariler in the same column regarding the loss of EN by the patient is: "If the roll in D100 is equal to or less than the success percentage, the patient is resurrected with their body whole. Their Endurance is decreased by one, though all of their other stats remain as before they died. If the roll is greater than the success percentage, the patient is not resurrected and their Endurance is decreased by one." The Bestiary description of Undead states: "Greater undead have the power to drain life force (in the form of Endurance and Fatigue) from living victims." But under the listing for Spectre is states: "...any character coming in contact with a spectre which is in full physical form suffers [D + 3] damage drained directly from Endurance". And under Wight it adds: "Whenever a character strikes or is struck by a Wight, the contact does [D + 2] damage" The word "drain" is used both for Undead and for the Phantasm in Healer, but in the case of the Undead the term "damage" is also used. Healer's patients have their EN "decreased", and the Phantasm drains power "reducing" the Healer's EN. The current rules as written appear about as clear as mud -- and GM opinions notwithstanding, do not appear to clearly indicate which interpretation was the designer's intent. So... What do we want the Phantasm to do? For myself, I'm tending towards the actual EN loss camp with Andrew and Jim... although I would note that causing the Healer to effectively lose 2,500 to 12,500 EP on a single bad dice roll seems a little nasty. Cheers, Martin -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 10:57:08 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA18871; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:43:50 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id KAA18868 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:43:47 +1200 Message-ID: <3932ECA7.5AA7E62F@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 10:18:15 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Re Healer From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote: > ...severed body parts which take player's 'x' inches length x days. *RASP* Not that I as a 6+ footer who happens to play a Halfling and a Dwarf would be bitter... but really... what a stupid rule. Does this mean that in certain odd cases involving players playing cross gender certain body parts either regenerate instantly or cannot be regenerated at all... or perhaps one must ask to measure them on another player in the group?! :) -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 10:57:45 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA18952; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:56:14 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id KAA18949 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:56:11 +1200 Message-ID: <3932F2D8.AEBD82FE@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 10:44:41 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Malignant Phantasm [was Re: Healer] From: Michael Woodhams To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: michael.woodhams@peace.com Martin Dickson wrote: > For myself, I'm tending towards the actual EN loss camp with Andrew and Jim... although I would note that causing the Healer > to effectively lose 2,500 to 12,500 EP on a single bad dice roll seems a little nasty. Hm, adventure idea: The guild resurrecter has only a few points of EN left. They need to go on an adventure, because for inexplicable reasons (EP), this aids in recovery of lost EN points. You need to take them doing exciting, dangerous (EP earning) stuff while at all costs preventing them from dying despite having EN of 5 and no combat skills. (Hey, I didn't say it was a *good* adventure idea.) Michael W. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 10:58:25 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id KAA18860; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:43:08 +1200 Received: from fclaklmr02.fcl.co.nz ([202.14.23.202] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id KAA18857 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:43:04 +1200 Received: from falaklex00.falum.co.nz (10.8.1.28) by fclaklmr02.fcl.co.nz Tuesday, May 30, 2000 10:27:40 Message-ID: Received: by falaklex00.fcl.co.nz with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:32:01 +1200 Message-ID: <311B3C3DD32FD311B33900805F770A72010B1503@falaklex00.fcl.co.nz> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 10:31:55 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9BD.B4594960" Subject: RE: Amulets of Jade for Sale From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9BD.B4594960 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" To Her Imperial Darkness, Just 'cos you are a tough assassin with flowery language and have a bunch of bovver boys to back you up doesn't mean that you get to tell me how to speak - you ain't my mother. Language is a communication thing, and I can lower myself to any level if it makes the message effective, as it obviously was with you. I'll face you anywhere, any time of day. Bring your apostate Michaeline lackeys with you though - I want a fair "discussion", no knives in the back, and they might learn how a real Michaeline treats with the Dark. Love & Kisses Sir Eidolon > -----Original Message----- > From: Fiona M.M.Cole [SMTP:fiona@ihug.co.nz] > Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2000 10:09 AM > To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz > Subject: RE: Amulets of Jade for Sale > > Sir Eidolon > Would you care to meet to discuss this decline in morals that has you so > concerned? Before you do I would suggest you first refrain from using such > filthy language. > > Lady Dark > > > > At 17:38 29/05/00 +1200, you wrote: > >F***ing rip-off. There's little old ladies giving them away at the docks > for > >passage north. > > > >If you don't trust them, you can get a guaranteed tried & tested jade > amulet > >on a real gold-plated chain & five evenings of all you can eat - buffet > or a > >la carte - at the Tar & Feathers brothel for an all inclusive price of > >5,000sp (or 6,000 guild scrip). > > > >Sir Eidolon, Warrior of Light > >(Someone has to stop the decline in morals spread by "heroes" such as > Lady > >Dark and this Kishwa) > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: scott whitaker [SMTP:kharsis@ihug.co.nz] > >> Sent: Monday, May 29, 2000 4:14 PM > >> To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz > >> Subject: Amulets of Jade for Sale > >> > >> I am selling 5 amulets of Jade on behalf of > >> Sharlin. > >> > >> Price is 7000sp each > >> > >> Contact Kishwa at the guild. > >> > >> > >> > >> -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- > > > > > > > > > > > >RE: Amulets of Jade for Sale > > > > > > > >

F***ing rip-off. There's > little old ladies giving them away at the docks for passage north. > >

> > > >

If you don't trust them, you > can get a guaranteed tried & tested jade amulet on a real gold-plated > chain & five evenings of all you can eat - buffet or a la carte - at > the > Tar & Feathers brothel for an all inclusive price of 5,000sp (or 6,000 > guild scrip).

> > > >

Sir Eidolon, Warrior of > Light > >
(Someone has to stop the > decline in morals spread by "heroes" such as Lady Dark and this > Kishwa) > >

> > > > > > > > -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- ------_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9BD.B4594960 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: Amulets of Jade for Sale

To Her Imperial = Darkness,

Just 'cos you are a = tough assassin with flowery language and have a bunch of bovver boys to = back you up doesn't mean that you get to tell me how to speak - you = ain't my mother. Language is a communication thing, and I can lower = myself to any level if it makes the message effective, as it obviously = was with you.

I'll face you = anywhere, any time of day. Bring your apostate Michaeline lackeys with = you though - I want a fair "discussion", no knives in the = back, and they might learn how a real Michaeline treats with the = Dark.

Love & = Kisses

Sir Eidolon

    -----Original Message-----
    From:   Fiona M.M.Cole [SMTP:fiona@ihug.co.nz]
    Sent:   Tuesday, May 30, 2000 10:09 AM
    To:     dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz
    Subject:       = RE: Amulets of Jade for Sale

    Sir Eidolon
    Would you care to meet to discuss = this decline in morals that has you so
    concerned? Before you do I would = suggest you first refrain from using such
    filthy language.

    Lady Dark



    At 17:38 29/05/00 +1200, you = wrote:
    >F***ing rip-off. There's little = old ladies giving them away at the docks for
    >passage north.
    >
    >If you don't trust them, you can = get a guaranteed tried & tested jade amulet
    >on a real gold-plated chain & = five evenings of all you can eat - buffet or a
    >la carte - at the Tar & = Feathers brothel for an all inclusive price of
    >5,000sp (or 6,000 guild = scrip).
    >
    >Sir Eidolon, Warrior of = Light
    >(Someone has to stop the decline = in morals spread by "heroes" such as Lady
    >Dark and this Kishwa)
    >> -----Original = Message-----
    >> = From:        scott whitaker = [SMTP:kharsis@ihug.co.nz]
    >> = Sent:        Monday, May 29, 2000 = 4:14 PM
    >> To:  = dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz
    >> = Subject:     Amulets of Jade for Sale
    >>
    >> I am selling 5 amulets of = Jade on behalf of
    >> Sharlin.
    >>
    >> Price is 7000sp each
    >>
    >> Contact Kishwa at the = guild.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html = --
    ><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC = "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
    ><HTML>
    ><HEAD>
    ><META = HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; = charset=3DUS-ASCII">
    ><META = NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version = 5.5.2448.0">
    ><TITLE>RE: Amulets of Jade = for Sale</TITLE>
    ></HEAD>
    ><BODY>
    >
    ><P><FONT = COLOR=3D"#0000FF" SIZE=3D2 = FACE=3D"Arial">F***ing rip-off. There's
    little old ladies giving them away at = the docks for passage north.</FONT>
    ></P>
    >
    ><P><FONT = COLOR=3D"#0000FF" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">If you = don't trust them, you
    can get a guaranteed tried &amp; = tested jade amulet on a real gold-plated
    chain &amp; five evenings of all = you can eat - buffet or a la carte - at the
    Tar &amp; Feathers brothel for an = all inclusive price of 5,000sp (or 6,000
    guild = scrip).</FONT></P>
    >
    ><P><FONT = COLOR=3D"#0000FF" SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">Sir = Eidolon, Warrior of
    Light</FONT>
    ><BR><FONT = COLOR=3D"#0000FF" SIZE=3D2 = FACE=3D"Arial">(Someone has to stop the
    decline in morals spread by = &quot;heroes&quot; such as Lady Dark and this
    Kishwa)</FONT>
    ><UL>
    ><P><FONT SIZE=3D1 = FACE=3D"Arial">-----Original = Message-----</FONT>
    ><BR><B><FONT = SIZE=3D1 = FACE=3D"Arial">From:&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></B= > <FONT SIZE=3D1
    FACE=3D"Arial">scott = whitaker [SMTP:kharsis@ihug.co.nz]</FONT>
    ><BR><B><FONT = SIZE=3D1 = FACE=3D"Arial">Sent:&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></B= > <FONT SIZE=3D1
    FACE=3D"Arial">Monday, = May 29, 2000 4:14 PM</FONT>
    ><BR><B><FONT = SIZE=3D1 = FACE=3D"Arial">To:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&= lt;/FONT></B>
    <FONT SIZE=3D1 = FACE=3D"Arial">dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz</FONT>
    ><BR><B><FONT = SIZE=3D1
    FACE=3D"Arial">Subject:&nbsp;&nbsp;&= amp;nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></B>=
    <FONT SIZE=3D1 = FACE=3D"Arial">Amulets of Jade for Sale</FONT>=
    ></P>
    >
    ><P><FONT SIZE=3D2 = FACE=3D"Arial">I am selling 5 amulets of Jade on behalf = of</FONT>
    ><BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 = FACE=3D"Arial">Sharlin.</FONT>
    ></P>
    >
    ><P><FONT SIZE=3D2 = FACE=3D"Arial">Price is 7000sp each</FONT>
    ></P>
    >
    ><P><FONT SIZE=3D2 = FACE=3D"Arial">Contact Kishwa at the = guild.</FONT>
    ></P>
    ><BR>
    ><BR>
    >
    ><P><FONT SIZE=3D2 = FACE=3D"Arial">-- to unsubscribe see <A
    HREF=3D"http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html&quo= t;
    TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html<= /A> --</FONT>
    ></P>
    ></UL>
    ></BODY>
    ></HTML>



    -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html = --

------_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9BD.B4594960-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 11:11:35 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id LAA19054; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:07:16 +1200 Received: from smtp2.ihug.co.nz (smtp2.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.8]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id LAA19051 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:07:13 +1200 Received: from user (203-109-144-43.ihug.net [203.109.144.43]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id KAA17512 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 10:55:39 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 10:55:39 +1200 Message-Id: <200005292255.KAA17512@smtp2.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: fiona@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Sir Eidolon bangs on From: "Fiona M.M.Cole" To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz At 10:31 30/05/00 +1200, you wrote: >To Her Imperial Darkness, > >Just 'cos you are a tough assassin with flowery language and have a bunch of >bovver boys to back you up doesn't mean that you get to tell me how to speak/ I have no ranks in the skill of assassin and really my boys are no bovver at all. >- you ain't my mother. Uriel blesses me every day Language is a communication thing, and I can lower >myself to any level if it makes the message effective, as it obviously was >with you. I hear your pain >I'll face you anywhere, any time of day. Bring your apostate Michaeline >lackeys with you though - I want a fair "discussion", no knives in the back, >and they might learn how a real Michaeline treats with the Dark. I'm fascinated and always willing to be tutored in religious matters > >Love & Kisses >Sir Eidolon And a warm platonic hug to you Lady Dark -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 11:26:40 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id LAA19135; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:18:31 +1200 Received: from smtp4.ihug.co.nz (smtp4.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.5]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id LAA19132 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:18:28 +1200 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p24-tnt2.akl.ihug.co.nz [203.109.245.24]) by smtp4.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id LAA00555 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:06:54 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 11:05:37 +1200 Message-ID: <01bfc9c2$67224200$18f56dcb@jimarona.ihug.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Subject: Re: Malignant Phantasm [was Re: Healer] From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Martin Dickson wrote: >The word "drain" is used both for Undead and for the Phantasm in Healer, but in the case of the Undead the term "damage" is >also used. Healer's patients have their EN "decreased", and the Phantasm drains power "reducing" the Healer's EN. The >current rules as written appear about as clear as mud -- and GM opinions notwithstanding, do not appear to clearly indicate >which interpretation was the designer's intent. It's pretty clear that the intent was to reduce the Healer's EN value. Which is to say, that the value would be changed as a result of a permanent reduction of the stat. The listed Undead don't reduce EN or FT values. They just suck a bit off you that you can recover later. If the Healer isn't threatened by something like the Phantasm, then there's no internal pressure for them not to raise whole villages of pre-living peasants. Jim. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 11:56:54 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id LAA19320; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:45:36 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id LAA19317 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:45:33 +1200 Message-ID: <3932FB1B.382DB519@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 11:19:55 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Malignant Phantasm [was Re: Healer] From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Jim Arona wrote: > It's pretty clear that the intent was to reduce the Healer's EN value. Which > is to say, that the value would be changed as a result of a permanent > reduction of the stat. So, Phantasm special effect aside, Successful Ressurect: Patient has EN reduced by 1, Healer loses 8 "spell" FT Unsuccessful Ressurect: Patient has EN reduced by 1 and remains dead. Body is preserved 1 day. Healer loses 8 "spell" FT. Backfire Ressurect: Patient has EN reduced by 1 and remains dead. Body is preserved 1 day. Healer loses 8 "spell" FT, and has EN reduced by [D-5], minimum 1. I do agree that this is a sensible and desirable interpretation... although as stated earlier, the 1-5 EN loss range is a bit evil, IMHO. Cheers, Martin -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 11:58:12 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id LAA19354; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:50:07 +1200 Received: from akl-notes.aj.co.nz (ns.aj.co.nz [202.27.194.165] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id LAA19334 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:50:01 +1200 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 11:36:45 +1200 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on akl-notes.aj.co.nz/AJNzl/NZ(Release 5.0.3 (Intl)|21 March 2000) at 30/05/2000 11:36:50, Serialize complete at 30/05/2000 11:36:50 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 00005025CC2568EF_=" Subject: Re: Re Healer From: RMansfield@aj.co.nz To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 00005025CC2568EF_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Martin Wrote: > ...severed body parts which take player's 'x' inches length x days. *RASP* Not that I as a 6+ footer who happens to play a Halfling and a Dwarf would be bitter... but really... what a stupid rule. Does this mean that in certain odd cases involving players playing cross gender certain body parts either regenerate instantly or cannot be regenerated at all... or perhaps one must ask to measure them on another player in the group?! :) I agree that this is a silly arbitrary rule. In fact even (15 - Ranks) days for organs is silly - the healer has to have at least rank 9 to regenerate ... < If > we want to make a change how about (i) ignoring rank, (ii) using one time calculation for all regeneration (iii) taking the size factors from Table 54.3 Armour Regeneration Time=(racial size factor) x days This would make it dependent on the generic size of the entity but independent on the amount of body missing. And be simple to work out. It gives a range of 3 - 9 and 6 days for humans. Rosemary --=_alternative 00005025CC2568EF_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Martin Wrote:
> ...severed body parts which take player's 'x' inches length x days.

*RASP*

Not that I as a 6+ footer who happens to play a Halfling and a Dwarf
would be bitter... but really... what a stupid rule.

Does this mean that in certain odd cases involving players playing cross
gender certain body parts either regenerate instantly or cannot be
regenerated at all... or perhaps one must ask to measure them on another
player in the group?!  :)
I agree that this is a silly arbitrary rule.
In fact even (15 - Ranks)  days  for organs is silly - the healer has to have at least rank 9 to regenerate ...

< If > we want to make a change how about
(i) ignoring rank,
(ii)  using one time calculation for all regeneration
(iii) taking the size factors from Table 54.3 Armour

Regeneration Time=(racial size factor) x days

This would make it dependent on the generic size of the entity but independent on the amount of body missing.  And be simple to work out.  It gives a range of 3 - 9 and 6 days for humans.


Rosemary --=_alternative 00005025CC2568EF_=-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 12:11:52 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id MAA19462; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:02:19 +1200 Received: from smtp4.ihug.co.nz (smtp4.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.5]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id MAA19458 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:02:16 +1200 Received: from phaeton (p9-max20.akl.ihug.co.nz [203.109.157.9]) by smtp4.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id LAA05918 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:50:41 +1200 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000530114547.008b2790@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 11:45:47 +1200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Keith Smith To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz > Hi Rosemary, The current Healer rules appear to specifically allow for >this possibility. Paragraph just after ressurection details: "If a >character’s life-force is placed in another’s body, they retain any magical >abilities, the skill Ranks are halved (rounding down) and the combat >abilities are those of the previous inhabitant of the body. The temporary >union of life-force and body uses the value of the body’s first four >characteristics, and the value of the life-force’s characteristics for the >remainder." I don't think these rules are ideal -- having the combat >abilities of the previous inhabitant is particularly weird -- but the rules >themselves appear fairly clear on the matter. Actually I've had this happen to one of my characters. What is intended is that the physical stats are derived from the new host body, while the mental stats come from the life-force within it. Thus the PS, EN, MD and AG would reflect the new body while MA and WP is transferred over. Keith (phaeton@ihug.co.nz) -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 12:12:54 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id MAA19505; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:07:25 +1200 Received: from smtp4.ihug.co.nz (smtp4.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.5]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id MAA19502 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:07:22 +1200 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p24-tnt2.akl.ihug.co.nz [203.109.245.24]) by smtp4.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id LAA06889 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 11:55:46 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 11:54:31 +1200 Message-ID: <01bfc9c9$3bad8420$18f56dcb@jimarona.ihug.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Subject: Re: Malignant Phantasm [was Re: Healer] From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Martin Dickson wrote: >So, Phantasm special effect aside, > >Successful Ressurect: Patient has EN reduced by 1, Healer loses 8 "spell" FT >Unsuccessful Ressurect: Patient has EN reduced by 1 and remains dead. Body is >preserved 1 day. Healer loses 8 "spell" FT. >Backfire Ressurect: Patient has EN reduced by 1 and remains dead. Body is >preserved 1 day. Healer loses 8 "spell" FT, and has EN reduced by [D-5], minimum >1. > >I do agree that this is a sensible and desirable interpretation... although as >stated earlier, the 1-5 EN loss range is a bit evil, IMHO. Yes, but bear in mind how rarely it will happen, and that although there's a 1 in 10 chance of losing 12,500 xp as a result of a failure, the mean loss is about 2.5 or thereabouts. As far as I can see, you're looking at a critical failure chance that approaches 1 in 100... I don't think it's too severe. I wouldn't like to have to attempt a resurrection where the body was so badly wrecked that it incurred some truly outrageous penalties, but then, how else do you represent the difficulty of raising someone who's been spread across three counties except by the fear and trembling of the poor Healer lumbered with the task? Jim. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 12:26:37 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id MAA19660; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:20:15 +1200 Received: from smtp4.ihug.co.nz (smtp4.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.5]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id MAA19657 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:20:11 +1200 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p24-tnt2.akl.ihug.co.nz [203.109.245.24]) by smtp4.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id MAA08992 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:08:35 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 12:07:20 +1200 Message-ID: <01bfc9cb$05e1ee60$18f56dcb@jimarona.ihug.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Martin Dickson wrote: >> Hi Rosemary, The current Healer rules appear to specifically allow for >>this possibility. Paragraph just after ressurection details: "If a >>character’s life-force is placed in another’s body, they retain any magical >>abilities, the skill Ranks are halved (rounding down) and the combat >>abilities are those of the previous inhabitant of the body. The temporary >>union of life-force and body uses the value of the body’s first four >>characteristics, and the value of the life-force’s characteristics for the >>remainder." I don't think these rules are ideal -- having the combat >>abilities of the previous inhabitant is particularly weird -- but the rules >>themselves appear fairly clear on the matter. Keith Smith wrote: >Actually I've had this happen to one of my characters. What is intended is >that the physical stats are derived from the new host body, while the >mental stats come from the life-force within it. > >Thus the PS, EN, MD and AG would reflect the new body while MA and WP is >transferred over. And, PC and FT. Jim. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 12:41:35 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id MAA19748; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:34:14 +1200 Received: from kakapo.cs.auckland.ac.nz (kakapo.cs.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.34.10]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id MAA19745 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:34:11 +1200 Received: from [130.216.108.110] (clare.cs.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.108.110]) by kakapo.cs.auckland.ac.nz (8.8.6/8.8.6/cs-master) with ESMTP id MAA23691 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:22:35 +1200 (NZST) (sender clare@cs.auckland.ac.nz) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: clare@staffpop.cs.auckland.ac.nz Message-Id: Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 12:22:41 +1200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Subject: Re: Malignant Phantasm [was Re: Healer] From: clare@cs.auckland.ac.nz (Clare West) To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz > Yes, but bear in mind how rarely it will happen, and that although >there's a 1 in 10 chance of losing 12,500 xp as a result of a failure, the >mean loss is about 2.5 or thereabouts. The mode and median of the EN lost are 1, the mean is 2. I note: The change of backfiring for a healer with a lesser enchantment is: Rank 8: 2% Rank 9+: 1% it's more dangerous than many things we do, but then again resurrection is a rather miraculous effect. clare -- Clare West, Rm 111, Ext 8266 clare@cs.auckland.ac.nz -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 12:56:43 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id MAA19932; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:49:54 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id MAA19929 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:49:51 +1200 Message-ID: <39330A2A.3BB3CD90@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 12:24:11 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Jim Arona wrote: > >Thus the PS, EN, MD and AG would reflect the new body while MA and WP is > >transferred over. > > And, PC and FT. > Jim. PC I get... FT? Isn't that a function of fitness, vitality... puff? -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 13:12:01 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id NAA20115; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:10:39 +1200 Received: from smtp4.ihug.co.nz (smtp4.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.5]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id NAA20112 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:10:36 +1200 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p24-tnt2.akl.ihug.co.nz [203.109.245.24]) by smtp4.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id MAA16152 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:59:00 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 12:57:46 +1200 Message-ID: <01bfc9d2$118e0b20$18f56dcb@jimarona.ihug.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz >Jim Arona wrote: > >> >Thus the PS, EN, MD and AG would reflect the new body while MA and WP is >> >transferred over. >> >> And, PC and FT. >> Jim. Martin Dickson wrote: >PC I get... FT? Isn't that a function of fitness, vitality... puff? No, not according to the original rules. It is a measure of mental toughness, the ability to sustain activities requiring a great deal of physical or mental exertion. It goes on to mention that in Healer, in the section on temporary incarnation, that the new tenant has the use of the bodies first four characteristics (which would be 2.1 PS, 2.2 MD, 2.3 AG & 2.4 EN) and 'the value of the life-force's characteristics for the remainder.' That leaves MA, WP, PC and FT. Of course, this means that the body would then have the PB of the tenant...Since PB is 2.9, and therefore part of the remainder. In any case, it's a question of what makes the most sense. It seems to me that it is completely reasonable to have an elephant with a maximum FT of 10, and a mouse to have as much as 27. The elephant is sickly, perhaps, and the mouse possesses great gymnastic reserves of 'getting out of the way'. On the other hand, it's hard to sustain the notion of a mouse with 45 EN, and an elephant with 1 or 2 EN. Jim. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 13:13:17 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id NAA20083; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:09:10 +1200 Received: from mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (mailhost.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.1.4]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id NAA20080 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:09:07 +1200 Received: from sci4 (lbr-122-42.lbrsc.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.122.42]) by mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (8.9.2/8.9.2/8.9.2-ua) with SMTP id MAA23932 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:57:30 +1200 (NZST) Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 12:56:35 +1200 Message-ID: <000201bfc9d1$e76384b0$2a7ad882@sci4> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Subject: RE: Healer & Cantrips From: "Michael Parkinson" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Dear All, > > "If a > >character’s life-force is placed in another’s body, they retain any magical > >abilities, the skill Ranks are halved (rounding down) and the combat > >abilities are those of the previous inhabitant of the body. The temporary > >union of life-force and body uses the value of the body’s first four > >characteristics, and the value of the life-force’s characteristics for the > >remainder." I don't think these rules are ideal -- having the combat > >abilities of the previous inhabitant is particularly weird -- but the rules > >themselves appear fairly clear on the matter. > This service has been available in MMHS for years, as several guildmembers are aware. Of course they will not perform the service on persons who merely wish to change bodies for the trivial purpose of evading pursuit by various authorities -- unless the patient pays a substantial "good-will bond," naturally. Michael. PS: Tidy summary, Martin, of the various resurrection outcomes. I agree that the "permanent" Endurance loss is enough of a whammy to ensure that miracle of resurrection is squandered on the undeserving -- otherwise forcing Rk 8 healers to work in a production-line resurrection factory (with lesser Healers transferring the necessary FT, etc) would become an economic necessity for the town/nation concerned. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 13:15:11 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id MAA20001; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:57:18 +1200 Received: from akl-notes.aj.co.nz (ns.aj.co.nz [202.27.194.165] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id MAA19998 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 12:57:12 +1200 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 12:43:58 +1200 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on akl-notes.aj.co.nz/AJNzl/NZ(Release 5.0.3 (Intl)|21 March 2000) at 30/05/2000 12:43:58, Serialize complete at 30/05/2000 12:43:58 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 000677AACC2568EF_=" Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: RMansfield@aj.co.nz To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 000677AACC2568EF_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It looks like I missed a whole section accidentally from Healer. Oops.=20 But I've now got some questions.=20 If you are resurrecting to a different body does the original body have to = be there? The implication is yes but ... If the healer has 2 dead bodies can they resurrect which ever body they=20 feel like with which ever life force? Once they have done one mismatch - can they resurrect the 2nd at all -=20 because the healer no longer has the an original dead body (only a live=20 one with someone else at home)? Are then any other limitations / requirements? If they don't need the original body - how does it work? Aarrgghhh... Rosemary "Jim Arona" Sent by: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz 30/05/2000 12:07 Please respond to dq =20 To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz cc:=20 Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips Martin Dickson wrote: >> Hi Rosemary, The current Healer rules appear to specifically allow=20 for >>this possibility. Paragraph just after ressurection details: "If a >>character's life-force is placed in another's body, they retain any magical >>abilities, the skill Ranks are halved (rounding down) and the combat >>abilities are those of the previous inhabitant of the body. The=20 temporary >>union of life-force and body uses the value of the body's first four >>characteristics, and the value of the life-force's characteristics for=20 the >>remainder." I don't think these rules are ideal -- having the combat >>abilities of the previous inhabitant is particularly weird -- but the rules >>themselves appear fairly clear on the matter. Keith Smith wrote: >Actually I've had this happen to one of my characters. What is intended=20 is >that the physical stats are derived from the new host body, while the >mental stats come from the life-force within it. > >Thus the PS, EN, MD and AG would reflect the new body while MA and WP is >transferred over. And, PC and FT. Jim. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- --=_alternative 000677AACC2568EF_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
It looks like I missed a whole secti= on accidentally from Healer.  Oops.

But I've now got some questions.

If you are resurrecting to a differe= nt body does the original body have to be there?  The implication is y= es but ...

If the healer has 2 dead bodies can = they resurrect which ever body they feel like with which ever life force?
Once they have done one mismatch - c= an they resurrect the 2nd at all - because the healer no longer has the an = original dead body (only a live one with someone else at home)?

Are then any other limitations / req= uirements?

If they don't need the original body= -  how does it work?
Aarrgghhh...
Rosemary



"Jim Arona" <jimaron= a@ihug.co.nz>
Sent by: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz

30/05/2000 12:07
Please respond to dq

       
        To: &nbs= p;      dq@dq.sf.org.nz
        cc: &nbs= p;      
        Subject:=        Re: Healer & Cantrips


Martin Dickson wrote:

>> Hi Rosemary,   The current Healer rules appear to specificall= y allow for
>>this possibility. Paragraph just after ressurection details: "= If a
>>character's life-force is placed in another's body, they retain any=
magical
>>abilities, the skill Ranks are halved (rounding down) and the comba= t
>>abilities are those of the previous inhabitant of the body. The tem= porary
>>union of life-force and body uses the value of the body's first fou= r
>>characteristics, and the value of the life-force's characteristics = for the
>>remainder." I don't think these rules are ideal -- having the = combat
>>abilities of the previous inhabitant is particularly weird -- but t= he
rules
>>themselves appear fairly clear on the matter.


Keith Smith wrote:
>Actually I've had this happen to one of my characters. What is intended= is
>that the physical stats are derived from the new host body, while the >mental stats come from the life-force within it.
>
>Thus the PS, EN, MD and AG would reflect the new body while MA and WP i= s
>transferred over.

And, PC and FT.
Jim.




-- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html --

--=_alternative 000677AACC2568EF_=-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 13:46:52 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id NAA20353; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:40:34 +1200 Received: from smtp4.ihug.co.nz (smtp4.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.5]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id NAA20350 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:40:32 +1200 Received: from phaeton (p9-max20.akl.ihug.co.nz [203.109.157.9]) by smtp4.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id NAA20033 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:28:54 +1200 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000530132350.007e7c40@pop.ihug.co.nz> X-Sender: phaeton@pop.ihug.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 13:23:50 +1200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Keith Smith To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz > The implication is yes but ... > >If the healer has 2 dead bodies can they resurrect which ever body they >feel like with which ever life force? Yes, but the life force would tend to go to the body it came from originally. Maybe the Healer has to exert Willpower to get it in the other one. >Once they have done one mismatch - can they resurrect the 2nd at all - >because the healer no longer has the an original dead body (only a live one >with someone else at home)? They could possibly put another life-force in it, if one is recently avaliable. >Aarrgghhh... The way I see it, the Healer is calling back the recently departed life-force to occupy the avaliable body, the Healer being a conduit for this to happen. Keith (phaeton@ihug.co.nz) -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 13:47:47 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id NAA20274; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:32:08 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id NAA20271 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:32:05 +1200 Message-ID: <3933140D.1E657CC0@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 13:06:21 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Jim Arona wrote: > [FT]... is a measure of mental > toughness, the ability to sustain activities requiring a great deal of > physical or mental exertion. Then why is its initial value figured off EN? This would imply a physical rather than mental secondary characteristic. FT does seem to be sitting a bit unhappily in the middle of Physical and Mental. The current description of FT reads: "Fatigue is a measure of a character’s physical and mental fitness. The Fatigue characteristic represents the degree to which the character can exert themself before becoming exhausted, the number of minor cuts and bruises they can take before their abilities are affected, and the mental energy that can be used to cast spells". > It goes on to mention that in Healer, in the > section on temporary incarnation, that the new tenant has the use of the > bodies first four characteristics (which would be 2.1 PS, 2.2 MD, 2.3 AG & > 2.4 EN) and 'the value of the life-force's characteristics for the > remainder.' That leaves MA, WP, PC and FT. Of course, this means that the > body would then have the PB of the tenant...Since PB is 2.9, and therefore > part of the remainder. PB? Errr.... and we don't think that this is indicative of an error on the part of the witers? PB as written appears skin deep and can be damaged by scarring, etc. Certainly we can theorize on why PB might be intrinsic (inner beauty rather than superficial good looks), but it seems more reasonable (at least to me) to conclude that when the writer referred to the "first four characteristics" and "the remainer", they were referring only to the primary stats. PC is a function of experience, with a tiny bit of race thrown in, though its hard to say if the Elven +1 is for training/longer childhood or elven eyes. > In any case, it's a question of what makes the most sense. It seems to me > that it is completely reasonable to have an elephant with a maximum FT of > 10, and a mouse to have as much as 27. The elephant is sickly, perhaps, and > the mouse possesses great gymnastic reserves of 'getting out of the way'. > On the other hand, it's hard to sustain the notion of a mouse with 45 EN, > and an elephant with 1 or 2 EN. [Aside] A mouse with 27 FT would have to be successfully struck with a baseball bat some 5 times in order to kill it. I'm not at all sure that DQ FT points are analogous to D&D hit points which do have a "getting out of the way" component. I think that's more what DEF is for in DQ. The mouse may be very zippy and extremely hard to hit with the bat... but if you do manage to land a blow on the fuzzy little rodent, he's landscape. [/Aside] And should that zippy mouse be ressurected into a sickly elephantine body we would then expect it to be able to use its gymnastic feats? Or would we expect it to gain the elephants more modest stat? :) Cheers, Martin -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 13:56:35 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id NAA20490; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:50:44 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id NAA20487 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:50:41 +1200 Message-ID: <39331867.E16C1BFC@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 13:24:55 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote: > > If you are resurrecting to a different body does the original body > have to be there? The implication is yes but ... I don't see that implication myself... the relevant line simply reads, "If a character's life-force is placed in another's body...". It would seem possible to do this even if the original body was nowhere to be found, vaped, ashed, etc. > If they don't need the original body - how does it work? > Aarrgghhh... The Healer would seem to "reach out" somehow, locate the soul they want and install it. I find the way the limitations of this are written to be odd, and getting the combat abilities of the previous owner seems open to abuse. On the flip side halving the skills ranks is very odd too... I can understand how one might not want to try fiddly lock-picking with new and unfamiliar hands... but forgetting the words to epic poems or somesuch is odd if spell ranks go across. On the third hand, casual body switching isn't something I'd like to see happening, so making it costly is a good thing. If I was proposing rules for this I'd go for something like: PS, MD, AG, EN, FT, and PB are the bodies MA, WP, and PC are the souls Skills and Weapons are known at original ranks, but practiced at lowered ranks until re-trained at a lesser time/cost than usual to represent gaining familiarity with the new body. AG, and MD are similarly lowered until raised back to their original levels through training. This means that a new transferee will know what they did before (without gaining or losing weapon abilities), but fumble around trying to use them, and be clumsy and un-cordinated. If the new bodies PS was significantly different from their original I would also tend to require MD rolls to do some things, which may result in breaking delicate objects, etc, for a while. -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:14:55 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA20577; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:01:06 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA20574 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:01:03 +1200 Message-ID: <39331AD4.94065EE1@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 13:35:16 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Martin Dickson wrote: > PS, MD, AG, EN, FT, and PB are the bodies Come to think of it, I do half agree with Jim about FT being mental, so maybe average of body and soul for that. -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:17:12 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA20667; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:10:57 +1200 Received: from fclaklmr02.fcl.co.nz ([202.14.23.202] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id OAA20664 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:10:54 +1200 Received: from falaklex00.falum.co.nz (10.8.1.28) by fclaklmr02.fcl.co.nz Tuesday, May 30, 2000 13:55:25 Message-ID: Received: by falaklex00.fcl.co.nz with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Tue, 30 May 2000 13:59:45 +1200 Message-ID: <311B3C3DD32FD311B33900805F770A72010B150C@falaklex00.fcl.co.nz> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 13:59:39 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9DA.B9E28D50" Subject: RE: Healer & Cantrips From: "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9DA.B9E28D50 Content-Type: text/plain If there were people who wanted to abuse this, they could easily get a MA25 WP 25 character, find a professional warrior, kill them and lo - a medium fighter-mage with 20-25 in all stats. Lets leave this to wierd NPCs, not as a standard rules option for PCs to abuse. Andrew > -----Original Message----- > I find the way the limitations of this are written to be odd, and > getting the combat abilities of the previous owner seems open to abuse. > > If I was proposing rules for this I'd go for something like: > > PS, MD, AG, EN, FT, and PB are the bodies > MA, WP, and PC are the souls > > Skills and Weapons are known at original ranks, but practiced at lowered > ranks until re-trained at a lesser time/cost than usual to represent > gaining familiarity with the new body. AG, and MD are similarly lowered > until raised back to their original levels through training. > ------_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9DA.B9E28D50 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: Healer & Cantrips

If there were people = who wanted to abuse this, they could easily get a MA25 WP 25 character, = find a professional warrior, kill them and lo - a medium fighter-mage = with 20-25 in all stats. Lets leave this to wierd NPCs, not as a = standard rules option for PCs to abuse.

Andrew

    -----Original Message-----
    I find the way the limitations of = this are written to be odd, and
    getting the combat abilities of the = previous owner seems open to abuse.

    If I was proposing rules for this I'd = go for something like:

    PS, MD, AG, EN, FT, and PB are the = bodies
    MA, WP, and PC are the souls

    Skills and Weapons are known at = original ranks, but practiced at lowered
    ranks until re-trained at a lesser = time/cost than usual to represent
    gaining familiarity with the new = body.  AG, and MD are similarly lowered
    until raised back to their original = levels through training.

------_=_NextPart_001_01BFC9DA.B9E28D50-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:27:44 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA20824; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:22:44 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA20821 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:22:41 +1200 Message-ID: <39332339.DF104919@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 14:11:05 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Michael Woodhams To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: michael.woodhams@peace.com > "Andrew Withy (FAL AKL)" wrote: > > If there were people who wanted to abuse this, they could easily get a MA25 WP 25 character, find a professional warrior, kill them and lo - a medium fighter-mage with 20-25 in all stats. Lets leave this to wierd NPCs, not as a standard rules option for PCs to abuse. > > Andrew I agree. If it is NPCs switching bodies, then anything the GM says goes. If the GM allows a PC to change bodies they will have to fiddle things to keep game balance anyhow, so any rules are at best a rough guideline. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:29:14 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA20780; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:19:52 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA20777 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:19:49 +1200 Message-ID: <39331F39.58ABA15@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 13:54:01 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Malignant Phantasm [was Re: Healer] From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Jim Arona wrote: > Yes, but bear in mind how rarely it will happen... > I don't think it's too severe. OK, fair enough. > I wouldn't like to have to attempt a > resurrection where the body was so badly wrecked that it incurred some truly > outrageous penalties, but then, how else do you represent the difficulty of > raising someone who's been spread across three counties except by the fear > and trembling of the poor Healer lumbered with the task? He, he. :) Healer: "So, how much of the body do you have?" Adventurers: "How much of each leg do you need for a 'torso sized chunk'?" -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:30:23 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA20835; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:24:42 +1200 Received: from mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (mailhost.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.1.4]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA20832 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:24:38 +1200 Received: from sci4 (lbr-122-42.lbrsc.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.122.42]) by mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (8.9.2/8.9.2/8.9.2-ua) with SMTP id OAA06293 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:12:49 +1200 (NZST) Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 14:11:54 +1200 Message-ID: <000401bfc9dc$6cf532e0$2a7ad882@sci4> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Subject: RE: Healer & Cantrips From: "Michael Parkinson" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz > PB? Errr.... and we don't think that this is indicative of an error on the part > of the w[r]iters? Yes. Let us not forget, the original rules were badly written & we have tended to be like cunning lawyers arguing what a precedent *means*, rather than wise legislators writing what should *be*. However, both Martin & Jim bring-up valid point about the physical &/or spiritual aspect of Fatigue. Although I tend to the physicality interpretation (based on the "precedent" that Humans can't have 24 FT, the same way they can't have 26 EN as per the note to a table in §2.1); but it would be wrong to take that as the absolute aspect. Certainly there are disproportionate monsters -- not, I suspect. because the writers thought about it, but because they were erratic . > And should that zippy mouse be resurrected into a sickly elephantine body we > would then expect it to be able to use its gymnastic feats? Or would we expect > it to gain the elephants more modest stat? :) Unfortunately this will probably never be confirmed empirically. Anyone standing around watching an elephant rehearsing an acrobatic routine _deserves_ the dramatically inevitable. In response to Rosemary's questions > If you are resurrecting to a different body does the original > body have to be there? The implication is yes but ... I don't follow why the implication should be yes. The restrictions/modifiers relating to time since death, life/death prolonging etc could easily be related to the deceased's spirit rather than their [former] body. The other modifiers as to the body in which they are to be revived are all measure of how complete that new vessel is. The implications is that, if the party acts fast enough, there is no such thing as a irresurrectable death -- although some types of death *will* be incredibly expensive, wiping out years of training. > If the healer has 2 dead bodies can they resurrect which ever > body they feel like with which ever life force? Once they have > done one mismatch - can they resurrect the 2nd at all - because > the healer no longer has the an original dead body (only a live > one with someone else at home)? No hassle -- although the idea of "three cadaver monty" does spring to mind -- except the patients might object to having lost half their learned skills. Michael -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:31:52 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA20814; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:22:20 +1200 Received: from akl-notes.aj.co.nz (ns.aj.co.nz [202.27.194.165] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA20811 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:22:16 +1200 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 14:09:00 +1200 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on akl-notes.aj.co.nz/AJNzl/NZ(Release 5.0.3 (Intl)|21 March 2000) at 30/05/2000 14:08:59, Serialize complete at 30/05/2000 14:08:59 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 000E40D0CC2568EF_=" Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: RMansfield@aj.co.nz To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 000E40D0CC2568EF_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" The mouse/elephant analogy has kept me giggling but in the interests of writing sane rules ... I'd rather not see this being a standard ability at rank 8 but rather a 'blue moon' thing sorted by the GM. For the Resurrection rules I'd like something like: "In some rare instances a healer may be able to resurrect a life force into a different body. In this case the resurrected entity has the physical characteristics of the new body and the mental characteristics from the life force. It will take some months for the entity to get used to the new body and this will effect base chances of physical abilities. The GM will advise the specifics." Also I'd like to change the term "life force" to "soul" through out Healer. Does anyone object? Rosemary Martin Dickson Sent by: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz 30/05/2000 13:24 Please respond to dq To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz cc: Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote: > > If you are resurrecting to a different body does the original body > have to be there? The implication is yes but ... I don't see that implication myself... the relevant line simply reads, "If a character's life-force is placed in another's body...". It would seem possible to do this even if the original body was nowhere to be found, vaped, ashed, etc. > If they don't need the original body - how does it work? > Aarrgghhh... The Healer would seem to "reach out" somehow, locate the soul they want and install it. I find the way the limitations of this are written to be odd, and getting the combat abilities of the previous owner seems open to abuse. On the flip side halving the skills ranks is very odd too... I can understand how one might not want to try fiddly lock-picking with new and unfamiliar hands... but forgetting the words to epic poems or somesuch is odd if spell ranks go across. On the third hand, casual body switching isn't something I'd like to see happening, so making it costly is a good thing. If I was proposing rules for this I'd go for something like: PS, MD, AG, EN, FT, and PB are the bodies MA, WP, and PC are the souls Skills and Weapons are known at original ranks, but practiced at lowered ranks until re-trained at a lesser time/cost than usual to represent gaining familiarity with the new body. AG, and MD are similarly lowered until raised back to their original levels through training. This means that a new transferee will know what they did before (without gaining or losing weapon abilities), but fumble around trying to use them, and be clumsy and un-cordinated. If the new bodies PS was significantly different from their original I would also tend to require MD rolls to do some things, which may result in breaking delicate objects, etc, for a while. -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- --=_alternative 000E40D0CC2568EF_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
The mouse/elephant analogy has kept me giggling but in the interests of writing sane rules ...

I'd rather not see this being a standard ability at rank 8 but rather a 'blue moon' thing sorted by the GM.
For the Resurrection rules I'd like something like:
"In some rare instances a healer may be able to resurrect a life force into a different body.  In this case the resurrected entity has the physical characteristics of the new body and the mental characteristics from the life force.  It will take some months for the entity to get used to the new body and this will effect base chances of physical abilities.  The GM will advise the specifics."

Also I'd like to change the term "life force" to "soul" through out Healer.  Does anyone object?

Rosemary
 


Martin Dickson <martin.dickson@peace.com>
Sent by: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz

30/05/2000 13:24
Please respond to dq

       
        To:        dq@dq.sf.org.nz
        cc:        
        Subject:        Re: Healer & Cantrips


RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote:

>
> If you are resurrecting to a different body does the original body
> have to be there?  The implication is yes but ...

I don't see that implication myself... the relevant line simply reads,
"If a character's life-force is placed in another's body...".

It would seem possible to do this even if the original body was nowhere
to be found, vaped, ashed, etc.


> If they don't need the original body -  how does it work?
> Aarrgghhh...

The Healer would seem to "reach out" somehow, locate the soul they want
and install it.

I find the way the limitations of this are written to be odd, and
getting the combat abilities of the previous owner seems open to abuse.
On the flip side halving the skills ranks is very odd too...  I can
understand how one might not want to try fiddly lock-picking with new
and unfamiliar hands... but forgetting the words to epic poems or
somesuch is odd if spell ranks go across.

On the third hand, casual body switching isn't something I'd like to see
happening, so making it costly is a good thing.

If I was proposing rules for this I'd go for something like:

PS, MD, AG, EN, FT, and PB are the bodies
MA, WP, and PC are the souls

Skills and Weapons are known at original ranks, but practiced at lowered
ranks until re-trained at a lesser time/cost than usual to represent
gaining familiarity with the new body.  AG, and MD are similarly lowered
until raised back to their original levels through training.

This means that a new transferee will know what they did before (without
gaining or losing weapon abilities), but fumble around trying to use
them, and be clumsy and un-cordinated.  If the new bodies PS was
significantly different from their original I would also tend to require
MD rolls to do some things, which may result in breaking delicate
objects, etc, for a while.

--

_/_/  Peace Software New Zealand Ltd   Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com
_/     Martin Dickson                   Fax  : +64-9-373-0401
      Analyst                          Phone: +64-9-373-0400




-- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html --

--=_alternative 000E40D0CC2568EF_=-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:41:58 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA20988; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:37:34 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA20985 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:37:31 +1200 Message-ID: <3933235E.157BEAD1@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 14:11:42 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote: > I'd rather not see this being a standard ability at rank 8 but rather > a 'blue moon' thing sorted by the GM. > For the Resurrection rules I'd like something like:... These guidelines appeal to me. They would need to go through a GM's meeting > Also I'd like to change the term "life force" to "soul" through out > Healer. Does anyone object? Hmmm... "soul" has religious overtones... "life force" sounds SciFi... any more takers? Spirit? Essence? -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:43:25 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA20976; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:35:54 +1200 Received: from kcbbs.gen.nz (kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.1]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA20973 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:35:51 +1200 Received: from bear (c3640-as21.kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.141]) by kcbbs.gen.nz (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA17966 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:22:42 +1200 (NZST) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20000530142452.00840390@kcbbs.gen.nz> X-Sender: salient@kcbbs.gen.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 14:24:52 +1200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Sally Jackson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz At 13:24 30/05/00 +1200, Martin wrote: >RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote: > >> >> If you are resurrecting to a different body does the original body >> have to be there? The implication is yes but ... > >I don't see that implication myself... the relevant line simply reads, >"If a character's life-force is placed in another's body...". > >It would seem possible to do this even if the original body was nowhere >to be found, vaped, ashed, etc. If the body or remnants was not required, how does one define "Irresurectably dead". Also, how would the healer know which is the particular life force amongst the millions that they're after? I agree that we don't want to make it a common/easy task, as what chance does it give characters to permanently wipe out those nasty NPCs? Regards, Sally -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:57:15 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA21185; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:55:07 +1200 Received: from mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (mailhost.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.1.4]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA21176 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:55:03 +1200 Received: from sci4 (lbr-122-42.lbrsc.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.122.42]) by mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (8.9.2/8.9.2/8.9.2-ua) with SMTP id OAA11590 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:43:18 +1200 (NZST) Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 14:42:24 +1200 Message-ID: <000901bfc9e0$af4e3a20$2a7ad882@sci4> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Subject: RE: Healer & Cantrips From: "Michael Parkinson" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz > > Also I'd like to change the term "life force" to "soul" through out > > Healer. Does anyone object? > I don't -- but I suspect the Michaelines would. As Sir Bernard would point out, its one of those irregular declensions. I have a soul, You have a life force, He is a malevolent phantasm > > Hmmm... "soul" has religious overtones... "life force" sounds SciFi... > any more takers? Spirit? Essence? what's wrong with ghost? every one knows what one of those is, from teh DQ point of view. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:58:11 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA21103; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:48:56 +1200 Received: from defacto.peace.co.nz (defacto.peace.co.nz [202.14.141.225]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA21100 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:48:54 +1200 Message-ID: <39332607.3ECEAEA7@peace.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 14:23:03 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: Martin Dickson To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Michael Parkinson wrote: > Yes. Let us not forget, the original rules were badly written & we have tended to be like cunning > lawyers arguing what a precedent *means*, rather than wise legislators writing what should *be*. [Completely unsupported opinion follows] I tend to agree, and think that the original shape of the rules has had an effect on the way in which we interpret them, and the culture of the GMs. The original rules were written by wargamers, and after the fashion of wargames rules. This in turn has lead to us arguing them in the fashion of wargames rules... quibbling over punctuation and trying to get our heavy cavalry that extra 1mm. If they had been written the rules more in prose and with less legalese we would probably still be arguing original intent but would perhaps be less hung up on exact wording. Of course, if the original rules had been written by White Wolf, we'd have a "Storyteller's Coterie", rather than GM's meetings, and be expected to dress in black and lace and make dramatic gestures. :) -- _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com _/ Martin Dickson Fax : +64-9-373-0401 Analyst Phone: +64-9-373-0400 -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 14:58:58 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id OAA21052; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:44:01 +1200 Received: from mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (mailhost.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.1.4]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id OAA21049 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:43:56 +1200 Received: from sci4 (lbr-122-42.lbrsc.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.122.42]) by mailhost.auckland.ac.nz (8.9.2/8.9.2/8.9.2-ua) with SMTP id OAA09745 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 14:32:16 +1200 (NZST) Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 14:31:22 +1200 Message-ID: <000801bfc9df$24ba43a0$2a7ad882@sci4> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Subject: RE: Healer & Cantrips From: "Michael Parkinson" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Dear All, > If there were people who wanted to abuse this, they could easily get a MA25 WP 25 > character, find a > professional warrior, kill them and lo - a medium fighter-mage with 20-25 in all stats. > Lets leave > this to weird NPCs, not as a standard rules option for PCs to abuse. > Andrew This *is* a possibility, and should be permissible [albeit illegal in certain states] provided the character is prepared to pay the social cost, as well as losing the skills. Not to worry, Bold Sir Christopher, a certain MA26 WP26 Namer has no intention of possessing your body -- on moral, rather than merely pragmatic or aesthetic, grounds. As a GM, I don't think the guild should allow body-hopping except in exceptional circumstances. E.g., if a villain maliciously destroys a guildmember's body, I'm sure most would find it acceptable for the party to capture & kill said villain & put the Ghoulled-member's spirit into that carcass -- talk about "eye for an eye." On the other-hand, the guild has had a couple of successful campaigns against opponents in the 2nd-hand body trade, in the full knowledge that the guild was, for once, taking the high moral ground. Michael -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 15:11:49 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id PAA21332; Tue, 30 May 2000 15:06:09 +1200 Received: from akl-notes.aj.co.nz (ns.aj.co.nz [202.27.194.165] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id PAA21328 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 15:06:01 +1200 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 14:52:36 +1200 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on akl-notes.aj.co.nz/AJNzl/NZ(Release 5.0.3 (Intl)|21 March 2000) at 30/05/2000 14:52:47, Serialize complete at 30/05/2000 14:52:47 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 00123EAFCC2568EF_=" Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips/ Agenda Item From: RMansfield@aj.co.nz To: dq-announce@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq-announce@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 00123EAFCC2568EF_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable With all the discussion on whether and how a healer can resurrect an=20 entity into a different body I'd like to propose a change to Healer skill: Original rules:=20 "A dead character may take no action with their body. An Adept may compel=20 the body to speak by spell, and the life-force may be placed in another=20 body, which the player would then control. If a character's life-force is placed in another's body, they retain any=20 magical abilities, the skill Ranks are halved (rounding down) and the=20 combat abilities are those of the previous inhabitant of the body. The=20 temporary union of life-force and body uses the value of the body's first=20 four characteristics, and the value of the life-force's characteristics=20 for the remainder." New Rules: "A player may take no action with their character's dead body."=20 and=20 "In some rare instances a healer may be able to resurrect a life force=20 into a different body. In this case the resurrected entity has the=20 physical characteristics of the new body and the mental characteristics=20 from the life force. It will take some months for the entity to get used=20 to the new body and this will effect base chances of physical abilities.=20 The GM will advise the specifics." Thanks for the feed back on this, Rosemary Michael wrote: the idea of "three cadaver monty" does spring to mind=20 Sally wrote: If the body or remnants was not required, how does one define "Irresurectably dead". Also, how would the healer know which is the particular life force amongst the millions that they're after?=20 I agree that we don't want to make it a common/easy task, as what chance does it give characters to permanently wipe out those nasty NPCs? --=_alternative 00123EAFCC2568EF_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
With all the discussion on whether a= nd how a healer can resurrect an entity into a different body I'd like to p= ropose a change to Healer skill:
 Original rules:
"A dead character may take no action with their body. An Adept = may compel the body to speak by spell, and the life-force may be placed in = another body, which the player would then control.
If a character's life-force is plac= ed in another's body, they retain any magical abilities, the skill Ranks ar= e halved (rounding down) and the combat abilities are those of the previous= inhabitant of the body. The temporary union of life-force and body uses th= e value of the body's first four characteristics, and the value of the life= -force's characteristics for the remainder."

New Rules:
"A player may take no acti= on with their character's dead body."
and
"In some rare instances a = healer may be able to resurrect a life force into a different body.  I= n this case the resurrected entity has the physical characteristics of the = new body and the mental characteristics from the life force.  It will = take some months for the entity to get used to the new body and this will e= ffect base chances of physical abilities.  The GM will advise the spec= ifics."

Thanks for the feed back on this, Ro= semary

Michael wrote:
the idea of "three cadaver mon= ty" does spring to mind

Sally wrote:
If the body or remnants was not req= uired, how does one define
"Irresurectably dead".  Also, how would the healer know whic= h is the
particular life force amongst the millions that they're after?  

I agree that we don't want to make it a common/easy task, as what chance
does it give characters to permanently wipe out those nasty NPCs?
 --=_alternative 00123EAFCC2568EF_=-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 17:57:27 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id RAA22804; Tue, 30 May 2000 17:51:51 +1200 Received: from enterprise.iconz.co.nz (enterprise.iconz.co.nz [210.48.22.40]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id RAA22801 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 17:51:48 +1200 Received: (qmail 31799 invoked by alias); 30 May 2000 05:40:05 -0000 Received: from irc.dragonquest.org.nz (HELO mandos) (210.48.7.49) by enterprise.iconz.co.nz with SMTP; 30 May 2000 05:40:05 -0000 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 17:39:19 +1200 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Subject: RE: Healer & Cantrips From: "Mandos D Shadowspawn Esq" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz > Of course, if the original rules had been written by White Wolf, > we'd have a "Storyteller's Coterie", > rather than GM's meetings, and be expected to dress in black and > lace and make dramatic gestures. :) We would also play join the dots to create a character....thank goodness for legalese :0) Mandos /s -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 17:58:14 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id RAA22794; Tue, 30 May 2000 17:50:11 +1200 Received: from enterprise.iconz.co.nz (enterprise.iconz.co.nz [210.48.22.40]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with SMTP id RAA22791 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 17:50:08 +1200 Received: (qmail 31627 invoked by alias); 30 May 2000 05:38:25 -0000 Received: from irc.dragonquest.org.nz (HELO mandos) (210.48.7.49) by enterprise.iconz.co.nz with SMTP; 30 May 2000 05:38:25 -0000 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 17:37:39 +1200 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000A_01BFCA5D.C02FF180" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Subject: RE: Healer & Cantrips From: "Mandos D Shadowspawn Esq" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BFCA5D.C02FF180 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Also I'd like to change the term "life force" to "soul" through out Healer. Does anyone object? I would prefer to see life force rather than soul. No real reasons other than soul has religeous connotations that I think are inappropriate for DQ. Mandos /s ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BFCA5D.C02FF180 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Also I'd like to change the = term=20 "life force" to "soul" through out Healer.  = Does anyone=20 object?

 I would prefer to see life force rather than = soul. =20 No real reasons other than soul has religeous connotations that I think = are=20 inappropriate for DQ.
 
Mandos
/s
------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BFCA5D.C02FF180-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 17:58:57 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id RAA22762; Tue, 30 May 2000 17:48:57 +1200 Received: from hermes.telebusiness.co.nz ([203.97.136.3] (may be forged)) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id RAA22759 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 17:48:54 +1200 Received: by hermes.telebusiness.co.nz with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Tue, 30 May 2000 17:36:36 +1200 Message-ID: <51F30BB9AB60D311B4130020AFF7E3232419B9@hermes.telebusiness.co.nz> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 17:36:35 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: Amulets of Jade for Sale From: Terry Spencer To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz I have stood side by side Lady Dark, deep in the Dark circle, repelling the armies of undead and driving back the some of the foulest creature that Rashak can mustered. The Lady has earnt her title as hero and proven her high moral standing many times over. Turf. > -----Original Message----- > From: Fiona M.M.Cole [mailto:fiona@ihug.co.nz] > Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2000 10:09 AM > To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz > Subject: RE: Amulets of Jade for Sale > > > Sir Eidolon > Would you care to meet to discuss this decline in morals that > has you so > concerned? Before you do I would suggest you first refrain > from using such > filthy language. > > Lady Dark > > > > At 17:38 29/05/00 +1200, you wrote: > >F***ing rip-off. There's little old ladies giving them away > at the docks for > >passage north. > > > >If you don't trust them, you can get a guaranteed tried & > tested jade amulet > >on a real gold-plated chain & five evenings of all you can > eat - buffet or a > >la carte - at the Tar & Feathers brothel for an all > inclusive price of > >5,000sp (or 6,000 guild scrip). > > > >Sir Eidolon, Warrior of Light > >(Someone has to stop the decline in morals spread by > "heroes" such as Lady > >Dark and this Kishwa) > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: scott whitaker [SMTP:kharsis@ihug.co.nz] > >> Sent: Monday, May 29, 2000 4:14 PM > >> To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz > >> Subject: Amulets of Jade for Sale > >> > >> I am selling 5 amulets of Jade on behalf of > >> Sharlin. > >> > >> Price is 7000sp each > >> > >> Contact Kishwa at the guild. > >> > >> > >> > >> -- to unsubscribe see > http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- > > > > > > > > > > > >RE: Amulets of Jade for Sale > > > > > > > >

F***ing rip-off. There's > little old ladies giving them away at the docks for passage > north. > >

> > > >

If you don't > trust them, you > can get a guaranteed tried & tested jade amulet on a real > gold-plated > chain & five evenings of all you can eat - buffet or a la > carte - at the > Tar & Feathers brothel for an all inclusive price of > 5,000sp (or 6,000 > guild scrip).

> > > >

Sir Eidolon, Warrior of > Light > >
(Someone has > to stop the > decline in morals spread by "heroes" such as Lady > Dark and this > Kishwa) > >

    > >

    -----Original Message----- > >
    FACE="Arial">From:   FACE="Arial">scott whitaker [SMTP:kharsis@ihug.co.nz] > >
    FACE="Arial">Sent:   FACE="Arial">Monday, May 29, 2000 4:14 PM > >
    FACE="Arial">To:     > dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz > >
    FACE="Arial">Subject:        > ; > Amulets of Jade for Sale > >

    > > > >

    I am selling 5 amulets of Jade > on behalf of > >
    Sharlin. > >

    > > > >

    Price is 7000sp each > >

    > > > >

    Contact Kishwa at the guild. > >

    > >
    > >
    > > > >

    -- to unsubscribe see HREF="http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html" > TARGET="_blank">http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html > -- > >

    > >
> > > > > > > > -- to unsubscribe see > http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- > -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 19:41:36 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id TAA23602; Tue, 30 May 2000 19:34:29 +1200 Received: from smtp2.ihug.co.nz (smtp2.ihug.co.nz [203.109.252.8]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id TAA23599 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 19:34:26 +1200 Received: from ihug.co.nz (p35-tnt4.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.103.35]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id TAA18364 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 19:22:39 +1200 Message-ID: <39336D14.A2B31065@ihug.co.nz> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 19:26:12 +1200 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------98A6A994B3134DB636EFC9E5" Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: scott whitaker To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz --------------98A6A994B3134DB636EFC9E5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes I object most strongly as soul has gained too many religous connections to be used comfortably. Life Force is a sufficently neutral term that gets the whole menaing across. Changing it to soul seems to be a change for changes sake. Scott Whitaker RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote: > > Also I'd like to change the term "life force" to > "soul" through out Healer. Does anyone object? > > Rosemary > > > > Martin Dickson To: Sent by: dq@dq.sf.org.nz owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz cc: 30/05/2000 13:24 Subject: Please respond to dq Re: Healer & Cantrips > > RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote: > > > > > If you are resurrecting to a different body > does the original body > > have to be there? The implication is yes but > ... > > I don't see that implication myself... the > relevant line simply reads, > "If a character's life-force is placed in > another's body...". > > It would seem possible to do this even if the > original body was nowhere > to be found, vaped, ashed, etc. > > > > If they don't need the original body - how > does it work? > > Aarrgghhh... > > The Healer would seem to "reach out" somehow, > locate the soul they want > and install it. > > I find the way the limitations of this are > written to be odd, and > getting the combat abilities of the previous > owner seems open to abuse. > On the flip side halving the skills ranks is > very odd too... I can > understand how one might not want to try fiddly > lock-picking with new > and unfamiliar hands... but forgetting the words > to epic poems or > somesuch is odd if spell ranks go across. > > On the third hand, casual body switching isn't > something I'd like to see > happening, so making it costly is a good thing. > > If I was proposing rules for this I'd go for > something like: > > PS, MD, AG, EN, FT, and PB are the bodies > MA, WP, and PC are the souls > > Skills and Weapons are known at original ranks, > but practiced at lowered > ranks until re-trained at a lesser time/cost > than usual to represent > gaining familiarity with the new body. AG, and > MD are similarly lowered > until raised back to their original levels > through training. > > This means that a new transferee will know what > they did before (without > gaining or losing weapon abilities), but fumble > around trying to use > them, and be clumsy and un-cordinated. If the > new bodies PS was > significantly different from their original I > would also tend to require > MD rolls to do some things, which may result in > breaking delicate > objects, etc, for a while. > > -- > > _/_/ Peace Software New Zealand Ltd Email: > Martin.Dickson@peace.com > _/ Martin Dickson Fax : > +64-9-373-0401 > Analyst Phone: > +64-9-373-0400 > > > > > -- to unsubscribe see > http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html > -- > > --------------98A6A994B3134DB636EFC9E5 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes I object most strongly as soul has gained too many religous connections to be used comfortably.

Life Force is a sufficently neutral term that gets the whole menaing across.

Changing it to soul seems to be a change for changes sake.

Scott Whitaker

RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote:

 
Also I'd like to change the term "life force" to "soul" through out Healer.  Does anyone object?

Rosemary
 
 
 
Martin Dickson <martin.dickson@peace.com>
Sent by: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz

30/05/2000 13:24
Please respond to dq
        To:        dq@dq.sf.org.nz
        cc: 
        Subject:        Re: Healer & Cantrips

RMansfield@aj.co.nz wrote:

>
> If you are resurrecting to a different body does the original body
> have to be there?  The implication is yes but ...

I don't see that implication myself... the relevant line simply reads,
"If a character's life-force is placed in another's body...".

It would seem possible to do this even if the original body was nowhere
to be found, vaped, ashed, etc.
 

> If they don't need the original body -  how does it work?
> Aarrgghhh...

The Healer would seem to "reach out" somehow, locate the soul they want
and install it.

I find the way the limitations of this are written to be odd, and
getting the combat abilities of the previous owner seems open to abuse.
On the flip side halving the skills ranks is very odd too...  I can
understand how one might not want to try fiddly lock-picking with new
and unfamiliar hands... but forgetting the words to epic poems or
somesuch is odd if spell ranks go across.

On the third hand, casual body switching isn't something I'd like to see
happening, so making it costly is a good thing.

If I was proposing rules for this I'd go for something like:

PS, MD, AG, EN, FT, and PB are the bodies
MA, WP, and PC are the souls

Skills and Weapons are known at original ranks, but practiced at lowered
ranks until re-trained at a lesser time/cost than usual to represent
gaining familiarity with the new body.  AG, and MD are similarly lowered
until raised back to their original levels through training.

This means that a new transferee will know what they did before (without
gaining or losing weapon abilities), but fumble around trying to use
them, and be clumsy and un-cordinated.  If the new bodies PS was
significantly different from their original I would also tend to require
MD rolls to do some things, which may result in breaking delicate
objects, etc, for a while.

--

_/_/  Peace Software New Zealand Ltd   Email: Martin.Dickson@peace.com
_/     Martin Dickson                   Fax  : +64-9-373-0401
      Analyst                          Phone: +64-9-373-0400
 
 
 

-- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html --
 
 

--------------98A6A994B3134DB636EFC9E5-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 20:42:23 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id UAA24087; Tue, 30 May 2000 20:30:43 +1200 Received: from dns0.uk.neceur.com (ingate.uk.neceur.com [193.116.254.1]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id UAA24084 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 20:30:38 +1200 Received: from internal-mail.uk.neceur.com by dns0.uk.neceur.com id PzJ00u1Upappk1; Tue, 30 May 2000 09:13:18 +0100 (BST) Received: from thoth.uk.neceur.com by internal-mail.uk.neceur.com id KvC30m1UpaZm71; Tue, 30 May 2000 09:13:16 +0100 (BST) from thoth.uk.neceur.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) id KvC30m1UpaZm71 for (3.3.2/3.1.31); Tue, 30 May 2000 09:13:16 +0100 (BST) X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 09:13:15 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on ldn-thoth/E/NEC(Release 5.0.3 (Intl)|21 March 2000) at 30/05/2000 09:13:15 AM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: Re: Gods Meeting Agenda 4/6/00 From: ross.alexander@uk.neceur.com To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz A couple of things... 1. I should be able to get any changes done by Wednesday next week if I get the documents on Monday. 2. I would like a quick discussion on weapon spell durations to be added to the agenda. Either 2 minutes + 2/Rank (current for all except weapon of cold and weapon of flames) or 5 minutes + 5/Rank (new weapon of flames). Weapon of cold is a miserable 30 seconds + 5/Rank. Ross -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 21:41:31 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id VAA24596; Tue, 30 May 2000 21:41:00 +1200 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id VAA24593 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 21:40:56 +1200 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p176-tnt2.akl.ihug.co.nz [203.109.245.176]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id VAA00156 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 21:36:12 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 21:18:59 +1200 Message-ID: <01bfca18$16d5cf00$b0f56dcb@jimarona.ihug.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Subject: Re: Healer & Cantrips From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Martin Dickson wrote: >[Aside] A mouse with 27 FT would have to be successfully struck with a baseball >bat some 5 times in order to kill it. I'm not at all sure that DQ FT points are >analogous to D&D hit points which do have a "getting out of the way" component. >I think that's more what DEF is for in DQ. The mouse may be very zippy and >extremely hard to hit with the bat... but if you do manage to land a blow on the >fuzzy little rodent, he's landscape. [/Aside] I'm sure. It specifically says that that's what FT is, and I quote: 'The Fatigue characteristic represents the number of potentially serious wounds the character can turn into minor cuts and bruises by their adroit or random manoeuvring in combat...' > >And should that zippy mouse be ressurected into a sickly elephantine body we >would then expect it to be able to use its gymnastic feats? Or would we expect >it to gain the elephants more modest stat? :) If the elephant had some disease that reduced its FT, then the mouses FT would start out at the value listed, and would decrease as the depredations of the disease reduced it. I think, really, that this isn't so much about what the rules say, as what you think they ought to say. It's perfectly clear that the stat is supposed to be regarded as a mental stat, or at least a stat connected with your life force. It's irrelevant whether or not it is originally figured from EN, or AG, or any other stat at all. Ultimately, the issue is what do we want it to be, and why. I don't care what rationalisation we use, so long as FT gets to remain a mental stat and follows players from body to body. The problems really come down to the various transformations. If a character transforms, and you consider that they gain the FT of the crittur they turn into, then, they will mostly turn into big, tanky things with big teeth and heaps of the 'not being dead' flavoured characteristic points. FT is one of those flavours. It's dangerous enough turning into a mouse (max damage before death=5 or 6), without encouraging people to turn into bears etc. As it stands, and purely for balance reasons, a character with 20 odd FT who has been turned into a toad can expect to have a chance against a cat, and , on the other hand, means that if you turn into a bear, you don't get access to 35-40 FT points. As it stands, the character would make a robust, and gymnastic mouse, and a sickly bear. Cool. Additionally, if FT doesn't remain constant with the character, then tracking damage between forms becomes problematical, as well. E.g. I am a human with 15 EN, and 20 FT, and have assumed the form of a bear with FT=40. I take 36 points of damage, and am forced, somehow, to return to my human form. Now, I have taken enough damage that my human form can no longer keep me conscious. Where does this damage go? Is all damage in the previous form lost, so that my human form would suffer no injury at all? Do I take a proportion of it? So, for example, a bear can have 40 FT, and I have 20, so if the bear takes 10 damage, I (in human form) take 5 damage? Or, does the damage stay the same, but the ability of the form to withstand the damage changes, so if the bear takes 36 points of damage, the human form is reduced to -1 EN, and dying? Admittedly, EN is a stat that should reasonable alter when a form changes, but the fewer stats that do, the less advantage, and the less bookkeeping involved in tidying up the mess. Jim. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 22:11:40 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id WAA24792; Tue, 30 May 2000 22:03:05 +1200 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id WAA24789 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 22:03:02 +1200 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p176-tnt2.akl.ihug.co.nz [203.109.245.176]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id VAA03438 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 21:51:13 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 21:49:54 +1200 Message-ID: <01bfca1c$6867ee80$b0f56dcb@jimarona.ihug.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Subject: Re: Amulets of Jade for Sale From: "Jim Arona" To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq-pub@dq.sf.org.nz Turf said: >I have stood side by side Lady Dark, deep in the Dark circle, repelling the >armies of undead and driving back the some of the foulest creature that >Rashak can mustered. The Lady has earnt her title as hero and proven her >high moral standing many times over. Have you Dissipated yourself, recently, Turf? Rowan Velcanthus, S.C. -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html -- From owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Tue May 30 22:12:18 2000 Received: (from bin@localhost) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) id WAA24764; Tue, 30 May 2000 22:00:04 +1200 Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by mail.sf.org.nz (8.8.6/NZSFI-19980830) with ESMTP id VAA24751 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 21:59:59 +1200 Received: from jimarona.ihug.co.nz (p176-tnt2.akl.ihug.co.nz [203.109.245.176]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id VAA02927 for ; Tue, 30 May 2000 21:48:10 +1200 Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 21:46:51 +1200 Message-ID: <01bfca1b$fb175000$b0f56dcb@jimarona.ihug.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0041_01BFCA80.904C3000" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Subject: Re: Religion From: "Jim Arona" To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz Sender: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Errors-To: owner-dq@dq.sf.org.nz Precedence: bulk X-Loop: dq@dq.sf.org.nz X-Requests: To unsubscribe from this list, or change your subscription address, send a request to dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz. To unsubscribe from all lists on this site, send a request to all-request@dq.sf.org.nz. Reply-To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0041_01BFCA80.904C3000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Scott Whittaker wrote: >Yes I object most strongly as soul has gained too many religous = connections to be used comfortably.=20 >Life Force is a sufficently neutral term that gets the whole menaing = across.=20 >Changing it to soul seems to be a change for changes sake.=20 And, George Mitchenson wrote: >Also I'd like to change the term "life force" to "soul" through out = Healer. Does anyone >object?=20 >I would prefer to see life force rather than soul. No real reasons = other than soul has religeous connotations >that I think are = inappropriate for DQ. I grow weary of listening to these tiresome points of view that merely = say what that x or y is 'inappropriate to DQ'. It is unexamined, and = doesn't further the game. It is most like, when you ask a player why their character did such and = such a thing, they tell you that 'it felt right to them'.=20 It may have been that it 'felt right to them', but unless the motivation = is examined by the player involved, then they are not telling me = anything about their character. I suggest that a player that says this = sort of thing a lot is merely reacting with thought any kind of thought = on what they want for their character. This is not to say that they are = power-gaming. I'd hesitate to call it roleplaying, either, though, = because it lacks any kind of internal analysis of the character being = played. But, back to the main issue, which is this: If you offer a comment about = whether or not something is appropriate to DQ, then it needs to be = justified in some way. Whether or not the issue is what part religion = has to play in DQ, it is not enough to say 'I don't think it's = appropriate' ,because all that may mean is 'I don't want to see any = development of the game'. As far as religion is concerned, however, whatever the desires of people = who have made comments about religion and DQ, it is as inevitable as the = impact of religion on our society. No culture springs into existence = without some religion. And, to use the inappropriateness of religion as = a justification for not using a term, whatever its connotations, is just = plain feeble. If the term fits, fine. My own feelings are that life force is better than soul because, it = seems to me, the previously living entity who owns that life force = hasn't yet moved to some undefined place where they might have been = judged or perhaps disintegrated into the very stuff of the universe, or = whatever. Soul, on the other hand, suggests that it's either on its way there, or = it's returning from such a place. Either is fine, and I don't have a = problem with it,but they suggest a degree of post-life activity that = pretty much identifies the religious background of the entities = involved. Jim ------=_NextPart_000_0041_01BFCA80.904C3000 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Scott Whittaker = wrote:
>Yes I object most strongly as soul = has gained=20 too many religous connections to be used comfortably.=20

>Life Force is a sufficently neutral term that gets the whole = menaing=20 across.=20

>Changing it to soul seems to be a change for changes sake.=20

 

And, George Mitchenson wrote:

>Also I'd like to change the term = "life=20 force" to "soul" through out Healer.  Does anyone=20 >object?

>I would prefer to see life force rather than = soul. =20 No real reasons other than soul has religeous connotations >that I = think are=20 inappropriate for DQ.

I grow weary of listening = to these=20 tiresome points of view that merely say what that x or y is = 'inappropriate to=20 DQ'. It is unexamined, and doesn't further the game.

It is most like, when you = ask a player=20 why their character did such and such a thing, they tell you that 'it = felt right=20 to them'.

It may have been that it = 'felt right to=20 them', but unless the motivation is examined by the player involved, = then they=20 are not telling me anything about their character. I suggest that a = player that=20 says this sort of thing a lot is merely reacting with thought any kind = of=20 thought on what they want for their character. This is not to say that = they are=20 power-gaming. I'd hesitate to call it roleplaying, either, though, = because it=20 lacks any kind of internal analysis of the character being = played.

But, back to the main = issue, which is=20 this: If you offer a comment about whether or not something is = appropriate to=20 DQ, then it needs to be justified in some way. Whether or not the issue = is what=20 part religion has to play in DQ, it is not enough to say 'I don't think = it's=20 appropriate' ,because all that may mean is 'I don't want to see any = development=20 of the game'.

As far as religion is = concerned,=20 however, whatever the desires of people who have made comments about = religion=20 and DQ, it is as inevitable as the impact of religion on our society. No = culture=20 springs into existence without some religion. And, to use the = inappropriateness=20 of religion as a justification for not using a term, whatever its = connotations,=20 is just plain feeble. If the term fits, fine.

My own feelings are that = life force is=20 better than soul because, it seems to me, the previously living entity = who owns=20 that life force hasn't yet moved to some undefined place where they = might have=20 been judged or perhaps disintegrated into the very stuff of the = universe, or=20 whatever.

Soul, on the other hand, = suggests that=20 it's either on its way there, or it's returning from such a place. = Either is=20 fine, and I don't have a problem with it,but they suggest a degree of = post-life=20 activity that pretty much identifies the religious background of the = entities=20 involved.

Jim

------=_NextPart_000_0041_01BFCA80.904C3000-- -- to unsubscribe see http://www.kurahaupo.gen.nz/mailing-lists.html --