At 23:17 20/08/02 +1200, you wrote:
>>Adding a bonus for casting while playing a instrument mean there is an 
>>active advantage to carting a lute around, and for casting with your 
>>hands full of something other than weapons.
>>
>Due to the fact that one or both (can't quite remember) must be free to 
>make the gestures for casting this means bards will get a bonus to casting 
>for using a lute or harp - both 2 handed instruments - but they won't 
>actually be ablew to cast.  Off hand I can think of very few 1 handed 
>instruments, as since they must vocalise spells most wind instruments are 
>not appropiate.

Actually they can. Bards are the one exception to the general rule that one 
hand must be free to cast. Instead they must sing their spells, the melody 
taking the place of somatic components.

Jacqui


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Jacqui Smith wrote:

> Bards are the one exception to the general rule that one hand must be 
> free to cast. Instead they must sing their spells, the melody taking 
> the place of somatic components. 

Hi Jacqui,

Could you clarify please -- can Bards cast while both hands are occupied 
with anything (e.g. sword & sheild)... or only while both hands are 
involved in playing a lute?

Cheers,
Martin

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> -----Original Message-----
> From: Martin Dickson [mailto:martin.dickson@peace.com]

> 
> Jacqui Smith wrote:
> 
> > Bards are the one exception to the general rule that one 
> hand must be 
> > free to cast. Instead they must sing their spells, the 
> melody taking 
> > the place of somatic components. 
> 
> Hi Jacqui,
> 
> Could you clarify please -- can Bards cast while both hands 
> are occupied 
> with anything (e.g. sword & shield)... or only while both hands are 
> involved in playing a lute?
> 

While on the topic....

from v2.1 proposal "The principal difference between this college and all
others is that the spell's verbal component is usually sung, instead of
spoken. Furthermore, because a musical instrument may be used to enhance the
effect, Bardic spells have little or no somatic component. It is almost
impossible for a Bard to cast quietly."

1. Words like somatic shouldn't be used without explanation.
2. What do you mean "almost impossible"!?! Are you saying that there are
times when it is possible?
3. Exceptions to such fundamental rules should refer to the rule, and
clearly spell out the differences.

Cheers
Errol


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Look again at Clairaudience.  First up your mechanic doesn't work and justification
doesn't apply as you can only move it by performing pass actions in which case
you are not moving your TMR.
Secondly every other similar scrying type magic has a speed that is either fixed
or based on its rank, you generally have the choice of moving the scry point
or moving yourself.  You can do both slowly by doing pass actions or you can
concentrate on your scry point and be carried.  This is a reasonably balanced
result in play.
And if you happen to be travelling at high speed (e.g. Flying) then your scry
point gets left far behind.

I agree with Clare on Legend Song, we don't want to take all the danger and
risk out of adventuring, nor do we want to require GMs to break the rules just
to add some danger.
Being able to use this ability at range is fine but it should not be the standard
method.  I suggest 3 hours to perform the ritual instead of 1 or dropping the
BC by 30 or both.  Or maybe it's a special ability gained at rank 20.
The only problem with the longer ritual time is that if the ability is there
and usable then people will use it and long rituals just serve to slow the game
down.
On reflection I think the Rk 20 bonus ability is my preferred option.

Cheers, Stephen.

>Modifications to Bardic College

>3.      Clairaudience
>Adding the Bard=92s TMR means it can always stay ahead of you, even when 
>you=92re moving.

>10.     Recitation
>Renamed to Legend Song, to describe the effect better. Range goes from 
>Touch to 10ft, so you can use the ritual to find out if something is 
>dangerous before you handle it.


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I just had to delete Jim Arona and Mike Young off the lists as e-mails to 
their addresses were bouncing.

Can anyone let them know and if they want to resubscribe, then have them 
e-mail me please.

Keith.


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RE: Shatter

I'm not an expert on the structural strength of objects and the effects of sound
but the order of these materials seems rather odd.

Rank Material
0 glass, ceramics
4 crystals
6 soft stone, earth
8 hard stone (stone golems)
10 bone or ivory (skeletons)
12 gems
15 hard metal (iron golems)
18 soft metal (bronze)

Anyone have an educated opinion to venture on the list?

Cheers, Stephen.


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At 11:16 21/08/02 +1200, you wrote:
>Could you clarify please -- can Bards cast while both hands are occupied 
>with anything (e.g. sword & sheild)... or only while both hands are 
>involved in playing a lute?

The intention was to allow them to cast while playing string instruments, 
most of which do require two hands to operate, as Scott pointed out. The 
result is that, certainly bards can cast with sword and shield in hand. As 
I stated, the melody replaces the somatic components, which is intended to 
balance advantage with disadvantage. After all, there is no way a bard can 
possibly whisper a spell.

Jacqui


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At 12:05 21/08/02 +1200, you wrote:
>from v2.1 proposal "The principal difference between this college and all
>others is that the spell's verbal component is usually sung, instead of
>spoken. Furthermore, because a musical instrument may be used to enhance the
>effect, Bardic spells have little or no somatic component. It is almost
>impossible for a Bard to cast quietly."
>
>1. Words like somatic shouldn't be used without explanation.
>2. What do you mean "almost impossible"!?! Are you saying that there are
>times when it is possible?
>3. Exceptions to such fundamental rules should refer to the rule, and
>clearly spell out the differences.

Okay, I feel I must point out that this section has been in the rules for 
some years now, and this is the first time anyone has complained, which 
suggests that the wording, although not as tight as it might be, is 
generally understood.

Striking out the word "almost" is a simple enough change, and would clarify 
the meaning, agreed.
I think that explaining the word somatic is inappropriate in this section 
of the rules. It should be somewhere in the header section on magic.
Perhaps a simple, "this is an exception to rule x:x" would suffice to 
clarify that point.

Jacqui


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