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OPPs hadn't quite said the other bit which is:
Favors are different to relationships. Favors are simple i.e. you did X for
me so I will do Y for you.
Relationships are complex and two way things.
A scale which shows the degree of relationship you have with a group is
quite different to a scale which shows how many favors you are owed by a
group.
Because relationships are 2 way they have to be reciprocal in some way and
if they are not then quite quickly the relationship turns sour, except with
ones mother and even this has its limits I would imagine :-)
SO in short I do not object to a relationship scale (weather words or
numbers) because the two way nature this will bring interest into the game
and cannot really be abused as long as the GM's understand it this way and
feel they can role play it.
H
Hamish Brown
Director
Zenergy
Whole People Co-operating in a Sustainable world
119 Mt Eden Rd,
Auckland
www.zenergyglobal.com
_____
From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of
Johanna and Hamish
Sent: Monday, October 24, 2005 3:50 PM
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [dq] State or Scale for Factions
It seems to me there needs to be a scale of some sort. Weather it is in
words or numbers a scale is a scale.
The issue seems to be weather the PC is in Charge of what they can buy; or
weather the GM is in charge of taking the pre-existing relationship into
account in the actual situation.
A simple scale is easy because every GM interprets it the same way and so
will the player (i.e. 20 pts = a resurrection) on the other hand its
simplicity also lets it down in the ways described by martin and andrew.
The Scale does not need to be PC driven (i.e. 20 pts = this; so I would like
it now please). It could be more relationship oriented i.e yes you are a
Hero (20pts or what ever) of X clan however while they are in danger of
being wiped out by clan Y they expect you to help them not to do so will be
seen as cowardly (-10pts). i.e. just because I have this relationship
doesn't mean I automatically get a favor.
OR yes they are very happy to see you they stop and prepare a feast in your
honor however the healer is out of town fighting dragons if you would like
to join her, this is the location, or you can wait - if she returns we
expect because you are a hero she will resurrect your friend - how else can
we support your quest mighty GoK?
This GM driven way of interpreting the scale or words (what ever you prefer)
means there will not be quite so much consistency in a multi GM world.
However it gives the GM's the discretion they probably want with such a
system and stops the players treating it like another form of silver.
What do you think
H
Hamish Brown
Director
Zenergy
Whole People Co-operating in a Sustainable world
119 Mt Eden Rd,
Auckland
www.zenergyglobal.com
_____
From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of
Jonathan Bean
Sent: Friday, October 21, 2005 2:46 PM
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: [dq] State or Scale for Factions
Hi all,
I want to see the faction (in what ever form) system move forward.
I do not believe that the system of "states" of relationships addresses my
personal desire to see a system that is able to be scaled.
I do believe it addresses the need of GMs of being able to see what
relations (as a report) each character has when dealing with NPCs.
A scale relationship does not have to be limited to a number system (you can
give it all unique titles)
Do people want either of the two types of - states of relationships or scale
of relationships, or is their a 3rd option?
Regards
Jonathan Bean
Business Development Manager
TME - Its all about time
Phone 966 1656 PO Box 35902, Browns Bay
Fax 448 1051 Auckland, New Zealand
Mob 021 173 4060 www.tme.co.nz
Free 0800 55 33 66
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<div class=3DSection1>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>OPPs hadn’t quite said the =
other bit
which is:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Favors are different to
relationships. Favors are simple i.e. you did X for me so I will =
do Y for
you.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Relationships are complex and two =
way
things. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>A scale which shows the degree of
relationship you have with a group is quite different to a scale which =
shows
how many favors you are owed by a group.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Because relationships are 2 way =
they have
to be reciprocal in some way and if they are not then quite quickly the
relationship turns sour, except with ones mother and even this has its =
limits I
would imagine </span></font><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy =
face=3DWingdings><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:navy'>J</span></fon=
t><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>SO in short I do not object to a
relationship scale (weather words or numbers) because the two way nature =
this
will bring interest into the game and cannot really be abused as long as =
the GM’s
understand it this way and feel they can role play =
it.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>H <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
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<div>
<p class=3DMsoAutoSig><font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3D"Book =
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Brown<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoAutoSig><font size=3D3 color=3Dblue face=3D"Book =
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<p class=3DMsoAutoSig><font size=3D2 color=3Dblue face=3D"Book =
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People
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</span></font></div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Johanna and Hamish<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Monday, October 24, =
2005
3:50 PM<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] State =
or Scale
for Factions</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>It seems to me there needs to be a =
scale
of some sort. Weather it is in words or numbers a scale is a =
scale.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The issue seems to be weather the =
PC is in
Charge of what they can buy; or weather the GM is in charge of taking =
the
pre-existing relationship into account in the actual =
situation.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>A simple scale is easy because =
every GM
interprets it the same way and so will the player (i.e. 20 pts =3D a =
resurrection)
on the other hand its simplicity also lets it down in the ways described =
by
martin and andrew.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The Scale does not need to be PC =
driven
(i.e. 20 pts =3D this; so I would like it now please). It could be more
relationship oriented i.e yes you are a Hero (20pts or what ever) of X =
clan
however while they are in danger of being wiped out by clan Y they =
expect you
to help them not to do so will be seen as cowardly (-10pts). i.e. =
just
because I have this relationship doesn’t mean I automatically get =
a
favor.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>OR yes they are very happy to see =
you they
stop and prepare a feast in your honor however the healer is out of town
fighting dragons if you would like to join her, this is the location, or =
you
can wait – if she returns we expect because you are a hero she =
will
resurrect your friend – how else can we support your quest mighty =
GoK?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>This GM driven way of interpreting =
the
scale or words (what ever you prefer) means there will not be quite so =
much
consistency in a multi GM world. However it gives the GM’s =
the discretion
they probably want with such a system and stops the players treating it =
like
another form of silver.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>What do you =
think<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>H =
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face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>
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</span></font></div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Jonathan Bean<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, October 21, =
2005
2:46 PM<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> [dq] State or =
Scale for
Factions</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Hi =
all,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I want to see the faction (in what =
ever
form) system move forward.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I do not believe that the system of
“states” of relationships addresses my personal desire to =
see a
system that is able to be scaled.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I do believe it addresses the need =
of GMs of
being able to see what relations (as a report) each character has when =
dealing
with NPCs. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>A scale relationship does not have =
to be
limited to a number system (you can give it all unique titles) =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Do people want either of the two =
types of
- states of relationships or scale of relationships, or is their a =
3<sup>rd</sup>
option?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Regards<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Jonathan Bean</span></font><font
color=3Dnavy><span style=3D'color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 color=3Dnavy face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Business Development =
Manager</span></font><font
color=3Dnavy><span style=3D'color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>TME - Its all about =
time</span></font><font
color=3Dnavy><span style=3D'color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3D"Courier =
New"><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:navy'>Phone =
<st1:Street
w:st=3D"on"><st1:address w:st=3D"on">966
1656 PO Box =
35902</st1:address></st1:Street>,
<st1:place w:st=3D"on"><st1:PlaceName w:st=3D"on">Browns</st1:PlaceName> =
<st1:PlaceType
w:st=3D"on">Bay</st1:PlaceType></st1:place></span></font><font =
color=3Dnavy><span
style=3D'color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3D"Courier =
New"><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:navy'>Fax 448
1051 =
<st1:place
w:st=3D"on"><st1:City w:st=3D"on">Auckland</st1:City>, =
<st1:country-region w:st=3D"on">New
Zealand</st1:country-region></st1:place></span></font><font =
color=3Dnavy><span
style=3D'color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3D"Courier =
New"><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:navy'>Mob 021 =
173
4060 www.tme.co.nz</span></font>=
<font
color=3Dnavy><span style=3D'color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3D"Courier =
New"><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:navy'>Free =
0800 55 33
66</span></font><font color=3Dnavy><span =
style=3D'color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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