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The other thing here is once a skill is written down it becomes prescribed.
One of the flavours of DQ as I have seen it played is that when something i=
s not explicitly spelled out then the laws of BDE come into play and some e=
ntertaining things can happen.
If I am in a bar room brawl and want to swing from the light fittings grab =
a chair and throw it through the window then jump out the window, the GM wi=
ll probably give me some sort of agility/md check to do it.
If I know however that at rank 2 fight'n and feud'n I have a 60% chance of =
light fitting swinging (+2% for a metal fitting, -2% per exposed candle on =
the fitting) and a 28% + md chance of grabbing a chair and a 45% chance of =
throwing a chair through a window (+1% per square foot of the window over 6=
square feet and -1% per llb weight of the chair over 20llbs) and a 67% cha=
nce of throwing myself out the window (-5% per class of armour), it makes f=
or extra paper work and dice calculation, slows down the action and does no=
t really add to the game. In fact as described it makes it highly unlikely=
that I would be able to do what I had wanted to do and which previously I =
could probably have done. Unless I took into account my rank 3 in dramatic=
architecture and rank 4 spatial awareness that allow me to add a % bonus f=
or knowing where the window and chair are in relation to the window and a b=
onus for knowing that chairs of that sort are particularly efficacious for =
throwing through windows if thrown a certain way.
The other thing with a new skill is that it becomes an EP tax. Something y=
ou have always done suddenly costs you ep if you want to have any chance at=
all of actually doing it in a half way decent fashion.
My thinking is that new skills that are not core skills, is that time is th=
e only thing that should be required to master them. Three (or four) level=
s should be all that is needed for most of them.
Apprentice, Journeyman, Master.
________________________________
From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of Mar=
tin Dickson
Sent: Thursday, 22 July 2010 2:50 p.m.
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [dq] skills
IMO there's a sort of "litmus test" around whether a particular skill is su=
fficiently important to the kind of game world, and style of fantasy play t=
hat we have in the campaign to warrant the complexity that Jim mentions.
For example, the Artisan skill was written the way it is because there were=
sufficient people who wanted to have a defined, in-game, ability with baki=
ng, or hat-making, or embalming, or cutting hair, etc, etc that having some=
way of representing this skill in-game was desirable, but the individual a=
bilities did not warrant their own separate skills as they were primarily f=
or flavour and interest, and not core adventuring abilities. The compromise=
was to have a single DQ skill to represent all these crafting / gathering =
/ service abilities, with the inevitable trade-off that the exact represent=
ation of hairdressing would leave something to be desired.
The question then for, Acrobat, to use your first example: is the represent=
ation of acrobatics currently within Troubadour sufficient for the general =
/ mainstream of the game? Tumbling and Juggling for example are not genera=
lly seen as primary abilities -- they may be handy to have, but don't stand=
at a level equivalent to a college, or warrior, or healer...
Now that may not be sufficient if ones personal character concept is less g=
eneric-European-fantasy and more Flying Tiger Hidden Dragon, but in that ca=
se, as Jim says, special quest / non-mainstream options may be needed to ro=
und out the character's skill set.
--_000_3439D88AC8B9534AB0C26F8CA8F055C6676EB58A1FGVW1154EXBame_
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<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D036073521-22072010><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>The other thing here is once a skill is written do=
wn=20
it becomes prescribed.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D036073521-22072010><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>One of the flavours of DQ as I have seen it played=
is that=20
when something is not explicitly spelled out then the laws of BDE come into=
play=20
and some entertaining things can happen.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D036073521-22072010><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D036073521-22072010><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>If I am in a bar room brawl and want to swing from=
the=20
light fittings grab a chair and throw it through the window then jump out t=
he=20
window, the GM will probably give me some sort of agility/md check to do=20
it.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D036073521-22072010><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D036073521-22072010><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>If I know however that at rank 2 fight'n and feud'=
n I have=20
a 60% chance of light fitting swinging (+2% for a metal fitting, -2% per ex=
posed=20
candle on the fitting) and a 28% + md chance of grabbing a chair and a=
45%=20
chance of throwing a chair through a window (+1% per square foot of th=
e=20
window over 6 square feet and -1% per llb weight of the chair ove=
r=20
20llbs) and a 67% chance of throwing myself out the window (-5% per cl=
ass=20
of armour), it makes for extra paper work and dice calculation, slows down =
the=20
action and does not really add to the game. In fact as described it m=
akes=20
it highly unlikely that I would be able to do what I had wanted to do and w=
hich=20
previously I could probably have done. Unless I took into account my =
rank=20
3 in dramatic architecture and rank 4 spatial awareness that allow me to ad=
d a %=20
bonus for knowing where the window and chair are in relation to the window =
and a=20
bonus for knowing that chairs of that sort are particularly efficacious for=
=20
throwing through windows if thrown a certain way.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN class=3D036073521-22=
072010>The=20
other thing with a new skill is that it becomes an EP tax. Something =
you=20
have always done suddenly costs you ep if you want to have any chance at al=
l of=20
actually doing it in a half way decent fashion.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D036073521-22072010></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN class=3D036073521-22=
072010>My=20
thinking is that new skills that are not core skills, is that time is the o=
nly=20
thing that should be required to master them. Three (or four) levels=
=20
should be all that is needed for most of them.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D036073521-22072010>Apprentice, Journeyman, Master.</SPAN></FONT><FO=
NT=20
face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style=3D"MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz=20
[mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Martin=20
Dickson<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, 22 July 2010 2:50 p.m.<BR><B>To:</B>=20
dq@dq.sf.org.nz<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [dq] skills<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>IMO there's a sort of "litmus test" around whether a particula=
r=20
skill is sufficiently important to the kind of game world, and style of=20
fantasy play that we have in the campaign to warrant the complexity that =
Jim=20
mentions.<BR><BR>For example, the Artisan skill was written the way it is=
=20
because there were sufficient people who wanted to have a defined, in-gam=
e,=20
ability with baking, or hat-making, or embalming, or cutting hair, etc, e=
tc=20
that having some way of representing this skill in-game was desirable, bu=
t the=20
individual abilities did not warrant their own separate skills as they we=
re=20
primarily for flavour and interest, and not core adventuring abilities. T=
he=20
compromise was to have a single DQ skill to represent all these crafting =
/=20
gathering / service abilities, with the inevitable trade-off that the exa=
ct=20
representation of hairdressing would leave something to be desired.<BR><B=
R>The=20
question then for, Acrobat, to use your first example: is the representat=
ion=20
of acrobatics currently within Troubadour sufficient for the general /=20
mainstream of the game? Tumbling and Juggling for example are not=20
generally seen as primary abilities -- they may be handy to have, but don=
't=20
stand at a level equivalent to a college, or warrior, or healer... <BR><B=
R>Now=20
that may not be sufficient if ones personal character concept is less=20
generic-European-fantasy and more Flying Tiger Hidden Dragon, but in that=
=20
case, as Jim says, special quest / non-mainstream options may be needed t=
o=20
round out the character's skill set.<BR><BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTM=
L>
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