There have been assorted discussions about the lack of fun of being incompetent on your first
adventure.  It doesn't take much to become a little bit competent in a couple of things and be
able to contribute a bit more to the party.

Proposal: Change the Background Experience in Character Generation from 250 experience to 2,500.

Current background Experience section included below for reference.

Cheers, Stephen.


Background Experience
A character now chooses any one Artisan skill at
Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained through
childhood and must be appropriate to their family
background.
They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together
with any left over from the non-mage generation,
can be spent freely.
At this time the character may acquire any one new
skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only 100 EP (rather than
the usual cost).
If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for
spending later in the game.


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I am awarding new characters 10,000 Experience and six months training time.



On 10 December 2010 12:08, Stephen Martin <stephenm@aklnz.net> wrote:

> There have been assorted discussions about the lack of fun of being
> incompetent on your first
> adventure.  It doesn't take much to become a little bit competent in a
> couple of things and be
> able to contribute a bit more to the party.
>
> Proposal: Change the Background Experience in Character Generation from 250
> experience to 2,500.
>
> Current background Experience section included below for reference.
>
> Cheers, Stephen.
>
>
> Background Experience
> A character now chooses any one Artisan skill at
> Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained through
> childhood and must be appropriate to their family
> background.
> They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together
> with any left over from the non-mage generation,
> can be spent freely.
> At this time the character may acquire any one new
> skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only 100 EP (rather than
> the usual cost).
> If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for
> spending later in the game.
>
>
> -- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --
>

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<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">I am awarding new characters 10,000 Exper=
ience and six months training time.</font></div>
<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif"><br></font><br>=A0</div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 12:08, Stephen Martin <span =
dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stephenm@aklnz.net">stephenm@aklnz.net</a=
>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">There have been assorted discuss=
ions about the lack of fun of being incompetent on your first<br>adventure.=
 =A0It doesn&#39;t take much to become a little bit competent in a couple o=
f things and be<br>
able to contribute a bit more to the party.<br><br>Proposal: Change the Bac=
kground Experience in Character Generation from 250 experience to 2,500.<br=
><br>Current background Experience section included below for reference.<br=
>
<br>Cheers, Stephen.<br><br><br>Background Experience<br>A character now ch=
ooses any one Artisan skill at<br>Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained th=
rough<br>childhood and must be appropriate to their family<br>background.<b=
r>
They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together<br>with any left ov=
er from the non-mage generation,<br>can be spent freely.<br>At this time th=
e character may acquire any one new<br>skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only=
 100 EP (rather than<br>
the usual cost).<br>If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for<br>spe=
nding later in the game.<br><br><br>-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:<a href=
=3D"mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz">dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz</a> --<br></blo=
ckquote>
</div><br>

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I think that Stephens idea goes some ways to addressing some of the issues
facing new players. In general I think its a good idea.

I would like to see that thing change by allowing new players to have
greater opportunity within DQ.
I think this will help retain new players. I would like to see that they are
able to start play in a low and/or med level game right away.
To assist this for the period of 2011, I would like new players, to be able
to start three characters as follows:

   - One character at 2,500exp no additional training time.
   - One character at 10,000exp and 6 months training time.
   - One character at 20,000exp and 1 years training time.

I am defining new players as a person with only characters of less than
13PC.
This I hope will allow for these new players to play in a range of games
with a range of players.
I expect that William Dymock-Johnson would be able to and willing to work
with the new players to assist them.

Kind regards,

Jonathan Bean
39 Sackville St, Grey Lynn
H: +64 9 376 2961
M: +64 21 917 173
G: jonobean@gmail.com



On 10 December 2010 12:08, Stephen Martin <stephenm@aklnz.net> wrote:

> There have been assorted discussions about the lack of fun of being
> incompetent on your first
> adventure.  It doesn't take much to become a little bit competent in a
> couple of things and be
> able to contribute a bit more to the party.
>
> Proposal: Change the Background Experience in Character Generation from 250
> experience to 2,500.
>
> Current background Experience section included below for reference.
>
> Cheers, Stephen.
>
>
> Background Experience
> A character now chooses any one Artisan skill at
> Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained through
> childhood and must be appropriate to their family
> background.
> They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together
> with any left over from the non-mage generation,
> can be spent freely.
> At this time the character may acquire any one new
> skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only 100 EP (rather than
> the usual cost).
> If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for
> spending later in the game.
>
>
> -- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --
>

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<div>I think that Stephens idea goes some ways to addressing some of the is=
sues facing new players. In general I think its a good idea.</div><div><br>=
</div>I would like to see that thing change by allowing new players to have=
 greater opportunity=A0within DQ.=A0<br>
I think this will help retain new players. I would like to see that they ar=
e able to start play in a low and/or med level game right away.<div>To assi=
st this for the period of 2011, I would like new players, to be able to sta=
rt three characters as follows:</div>
<div><ul><li>One character at 2,500exp no=A0additional=A0training time.=A0<=
/li><li>One character at 10,000exp and 6 months training time.</li><li>One =
character at 20,000exp and 1 years training time.</li></ul></div><div>I am =
defining new players as a person with only characters of less than 13PC.</d=
iv>
<div><div>This I hope will allow for these new players to play in a range o=
f games with a range of players.</div><div>I expect that William Dymock-Joh=
nson would be able to and willing to work with the new players to assist th=
em.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Kind regards,<br><br>Jonathan Bean<div>39 Sackville St,=
 Grey Lynn<br>H: +64 9 376 2961<br>M: +64 21 917 173<br>G:=A0<a href=3D"mai=
lto:jonobean@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jonobean@gmail.com</a></div></div=
><div>
<br></div><div><br></div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December=
 2010 12:08, Stephen Martin <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stephen=
m@aklnz.net">stephenm@aklnz.net</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padd=
ing-left:1ex;">
There have been assorted discussions about the lack of fun of being incompe=
tent on your first<br>
adventure. =A0It doesn&#39;t take much to become a little bit competent in =
a couple of things and be<br>
able to contribute a bit more to the party.<br>
<br>
Proposal: Change the Background Experience in Character Generation from 250=
 experience to 2,500.<br>
<br>
Current background Experience section included below for reference.<br>
<br>
Cheers, Stephen.<br>
<br>
<br>
Background Experience<br>
A character now chooses any one Artisan skill at<br>
Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained through<br>
childhood and must be appropriate to their family<br>
background.<br>
They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together<br>
with any left over from the non-mage generation,<br>
can be spent freely.<br>
At this time the character may acquire any one new<br>
skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only 100 EP (rather than<br>
the usual cost).<br>
If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for<br>
spending later in the game.<br>
<br>
<br>
-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz">=
dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz</a> --<br>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><br><br><br>
</div></div>

--0016e6dab4df5a7c47049702bb74--


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If William had a burning desire to become a one man character tribunal, he
would have signed himself up for it himself. In any case, we have an entire
population of DMs who are entirely able to work this sort of thing out.

On 10 December 2010 12:38, Jonathan Bean <jonobean@gmail.com> wrote:

> I think that Stephens idea goes some ways to addressing some of the issues
> facing new players. In general I think its a good idea.
>
> I would like to see that thing change by allowing new players to have
> greater opportunity within DQ.
> I think this will help retain new players. I would like to see that they
> are able to start play in a low and/or med level game right away.
> To assist this for the period of 2011, I would like new players, to be able
> to start three characters as follows:
>
>    - One character at 2,500exp no additional training time.
>    - One character at 10,000exp and 6 months training time.
>    - One character at 20,000exp and 1 years training time.
>
> I am defining new players as a person with only characters of less than
> 13PC.
>  This I hope will allow for these new players to play in a range of games
> with a range of players.
> I expect that William Dymock-Johnson would be able to and willing to work
> with the new players to assist them.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Jonathan Bean
> 39 Sackville St, Grey Lynn
> H: +64 9 376 2961
> M: +64 21 917 173
> G: jonobean@gmail.com
>
>
>
> On 10 December 2010 12:08, Stephen Martin <stephenm@aklnz.net> wrote:
>
>> There have been assorted discussions about the lack of fun of being
>> incompetent on your first
>> adventure.  It doesn't take much to become a little bit competent in a
>> couple of things and be
>> able to contribute a bit more to the party.
>>
>> Proposal: Change the Background Experience in Character Generation from
>> 250 experience to 2,500.
>>
>> Current background Experience section included below for reference.
>>
>> Cheers, Stephen.
>>
>>
>> Background Experience
>> A character now chooses any one Artisan skill at
>> Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained through
>> childhood and must be appropriate to their family
>> background.
>> They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together
>> with any left over from the non-mage generation,
>> can be spent freely.
>> At this time the character may acquire any one new
>> skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only 100 EP (rather than
>> the usual cost).
>> If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for
>> spending later in the game.
>>
>>
>> -- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">If William had a burning desire to become=
 a one man character tribunal, he would have signed himself up for it himse=
lf. In any case, we have an entire population of DMs who are entirely able =
to work this sort of thing out.</font><font face=3D"georgia,serif"><br>
</font><br></div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 12:38, Jonathan Bean <span d=
ir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jonobean@gmail.com">jonobean@gmail.com</a>=
&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div>I think that Stephens idea goes some ways to addressing some of the is=
sues facing new players. In general I think its a good idea.</div>
<div><br></div>I would like to see that thing change by allowing new player=
s to have greater opportunity=A0within DQ.=A0<br>I think this will help ret=
ain new players. I would like to see that they are able to start play in a =
low and/or med level game right away.=20
<div>To assist this for the period of 2011, I would like new players, to be=
 able to start three characters as follows:</div>
<div>
<ul>
<li>One character at 2,500exp no=A0additional=A0training time.=A0</li>
<li>One character at 10,000exp and 6 months training time.</li>
<li>One character at 20,000exp and 1 years training time.</li></ul></div>
<div>I am defining new players as a person with only characters of less tha=
n 13PC.</div>
<div>
<div>This I hope will allow for these new players to play in a range of gam=
es with a range of players.</div>
<div>I expect that William Dymock-Johnson would be able to and willing to w=
ork with the new players to assist them.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Kind regards,<br><font color=3D"#888888"><br>Jonathan Bean=20
<div>39 Sackville St, Grey Lynn<br>H: +64 9 376 2961<br>M: +64 21 917 173<b=
r>G:=A0<a href=3D"mailto:jonobean@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jonobean@gma=
il.com</a></div></font></div>
<div>
<div></div>
<div class=3D"h5">
<div><br></div>
<div><br></div>
<div><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 12:08, Stephen Martin <span =
dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stephenm@aklnz.net" target=3D"_blank">ste=
phenm@aklnz.net</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">There have been assorted discuss=
ions about the lack of fun of being incompetent on your first<br>adventure.=
 =A0It doesn&#39;t take much to become a little bit competent in a couple o=
f things and be<br>
able to contribute a bit more to the party.<br><br>Proposal: Change the Bac=
kground Experience in Character Generation from 250 experience to 2,500.<br=
><br>Current background Experience section included below for reference.<br=
>
<br>Cheers, Stephen.<br><br><br>Background Experience<br>A character now ch=
ooses any one Artisan skill at<br>Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained th=
rough<br>childhood and must be appropriate to their family<br>background.<b=
r>
They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together<br>with any left ov=
er from the non-mage generation,<br>can be spent freely.<br>At this time th=
e character may acquire any one new<br>skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only=
 100 EP (rather than<br>
the usual cost).<br>If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for<br>spe=
nding later in the game.<br><br><br>-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:<a href=
=3D"mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">dq-request@dq.sf.org.=
nz</a> --<br>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><br><br><br></div></div></div></di=
v></blockquote></div><br>

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I like Stephen's idea, it's very simple and would give a start up character
or a bunny party more options.

 

I'm not so keen on Jono's expansion of this idea for new players.  I have
various thoughts on this (not all of them anti :-) ):

1)       I don't see the benefit of a new player starting with three
characters.  They won't be playing in three games at once.

2)       I think the definition of new player should be having played less
than three games.  If they are still coming back after 6 months then they
shouldn't need any extra bennies.

3)       In a very low game players are encouraged to roleplay their way
through challenges as their abilities are of limited use when going by just
the numbers.  Many of our new players have a background of computer gaming
and we need to show them the benefits of roleplaying rather than number
crunching.

4)       I'm not keen on 20,000 or even 10,000ep free to new players
willy-nilly.  If they are in a bunny game then their characters will be 2 -
3 adventures tougher than experienced players - which doesn't feel fair.
Realistically I realise that we rarely need to run bunny level games; except
when we have a number of new players (established players probably only
generate new characters every 4-6 years). 

5)       I'm comfortable with Jim's "10,000exp and 6 months training time "
where a GM is fitting one or two new players into a game with established
players & characters.  But I think anymore than that & you loose one of the
strong DQ flavours - the huge influence your 1st few adventures have on your
character.  The struggle to find creative ways to use limited abilities is
really fun.

 

So in summary I agree that untrained adolescents aren't much fun to play,
new players need to encouraged, and being the bunny in a low game is pretty
frustrating.

 

Cheers

Rosemary

  _____  

From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of
Jonathan Bean
Sent: Friday, 10 December 2010 12:38 p.m.
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [DQ] Character Gen - Background Experience

 

I think that Stephens idea goes some ways to addressing some of the issues
facing new players. In general I think its a good idea.

 

I would like to see that thing change by allowing new players to have
greater opportunity within DQ. 
I think this will help retain new players. I would like to see that they are
able to start play in a low and/or med level game right away.

To assist this for the period of 2011, I would like new players, to be able
to start three characters as follows:

*	One character at 2,500exp no additional training time. 
*	One character at 10,000exp and 6 months training time.
*	One character at 20,000exp and 1 years training time.

I am defining new players as a person with only characters of less than
13PC.

This I hope will allow for these new players to play in a range of games
with a range of players.

I expect that William Dymock-Johnson would be able to and willing to work
with the new players to assist them.

 

Kind regards,

Jonathan Bean

39 Sackville St, Grey Lynn
H: +64 9 376 2961
M: +64 21 917 173
G: jonobean@gmail.com

 

 

 

On 10 December 2010 12:08, Stephen Martin <stephenm@aklnz.net> wrote:

There have been assorted discussions about the lack of fun of being
incompetent on your first
adventure.  It doesn't take much to become a little bit competent in a
couple of things and be
able to contribute a bit more to the party.

Proposal: Change the Background Experience in Character Generation from 250
experience to 2,500.

Current background Experience section included below for reference.

Cheers, Stephen.


Background Experience
A character now chooses any one Artisan skill at
Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained through
childhood and must be appropriate to their family
background.
They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together
with any left over from the non-mage generation,
can be spent freely.
At this time the character may acquire any one new
skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only 100 EP (rather than
the usual cost).
If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for
spending later in the game.


-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --








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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I like Stephen&#8217;s idea, =
it&#8217;s
very simple and would give a start up character or a bunny party more =
options.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I&#8217;m not so keen on =
Jono&#8217;s
expansion of this idea for new players.&nbsp; I have various thoughts on =
this
(not all of them anti </span></font><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy =
face=3DWingdings><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:navy'>J</span></fon=
t><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'> ):<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'><span style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>1)<font size=3D1 =
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I don&#8217;t see the benefit of a new player starting with =
three
characters.&nbsp; They won&#8217;t be playing in three games at =
once.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'><span style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>2)<font size=3D1 =
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I think the definition of new player should be having played =
less
than three games.&nbsp; If they are still coming back after 6 months =
then they
shouldn&#8217;t need any extra bennies.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'><span style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>3)<font size=3D1 =
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>In a very low game players are encouraged to roleplay their =
way
through challenges as their abilities are of limited use when going by =
just the
numbers.&nbsp; Many of our new players have a background of computer =
gaming and
we need to show them the benefits of roleplaying rather than number =
crunching.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'><span style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>4)<font size=3D1 =
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I&#8217;m not keen on 20,000 or even 10,000ep free to new =
players
willy-nilly.&nbsp; If they are in a bunny game then their characters =
will be 2 &#8211;
3 adventures tougher than experienced players &#8211; which =
doesn&#8217;t feel
fair.&nbsp; Realistically I realise that we rarely need to run bunny =
level
games; except when we have a number of new players (established players
probably only generate new characters every 4-6 years). =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'><span style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>5)<font size=3D1 =
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I&#8217;m comfortable with Jim&#8217;s &#8220;10,000exp and =
6
months training time &#8220; where a GM is fitting one or two new =
players into
a game with established players &amp; characters.&nbsp; But I think =
anymore
than that &amp; you loose one of the strong DQ flavours &#8211; the huge
influence your 1<sup>st</sup> few adventures have on your character. =
&nbsp;The
struggle to find creative ways to use limited abilities is really =
fun.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>So in summary I agree that =
untrained
adolescents aren&#8217;t much fun to play, new players need to =
encouraged, and
being the bunny in a low game is pretty =
frustrating.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Cheers<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Rosemary<o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter tabindex=3D-1>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span lang=3DEN-US
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</spa=
n></font></b><font
size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Jonathan Bean<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December =
2010
12:38 p.m.<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [DQ] =
Character Gen -
Background Experience</span></font><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>I think that Stephens idea goes some ways to addressing some of =
the
issues facing new players. In general I think its a good =
idea.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>I would like to see that thing change by allowing new players to =
have
greater opportunity&nbsp;within DQ.&nbsp;<br>
I think this will help retain new players. I would like to see that they =
are
able to start play in a low and/or med level game right =
away.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>To assist this for the period of 2011, I would like new players, =
to be
able to start three characters as follows:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<ul type=3Ddisc>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
     mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
     style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>One character at 2,500exp
     no&nbsp;additional&nbsp;training =
time.&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
     mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
     style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>One character at 10,000exp and 6 months =
training
     time.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
     mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
     style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>One character at 20,000exp and 1 years =
training
     time.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
</ul>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>I am defining new players as a person with only characters of =
less than
13PC.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>This I hope will allow for these new players to play in a range =
of
games with a range of players.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>I expect that William Dymock-Johnson would be able to and =
willing to
work with the new players to assist them.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>Kind regards,<br>
<br>
Jonathan Bean<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>39 Sackville St, Grey Lynn<br>
H: +64 9 376 2961<br>
M: +64 21 917 173<br>
G:&nbsp;<a href=3D"mailto:jonobean@gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">jonobean@gmail.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>On 10 December 2010 12:08, Stephen Martin &lt;<a
href=3D"mailto:stephenm@aklnz.net">stephenm@aklnz.net</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>There have been assorted discussions about the lack of fun of =
being
incompetent on your first<br>
adventure. &nbsp;It doesn't take much to become a little bit competent =
in a
couple of things and be<br>
able to contribute a bit more to the party.<br>
<br>
Proposal: Change the Background Experience in Character Generation from =
250
experience to 2,500.<br>
<br>
Current background Experience section included below for reference.<br>
<br>
Cheers, Stephen.<br>
<br>
<br>
Background Experience<br>
A character now chooses any one Artisan skill at<br>
Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained through<br>
childhood and must be appropriate to their family<br>
background.<br>
They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together<br>
with any left over from the non-mage generation,<br>
can be spent freely.<br>
At this time the character may acquire any one new<br>
skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only 100 EP (rather than<br>
the usual cost).<br>
If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for<br>
spending later in the game.<br>
<br>
<br>
-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:<a =
href=3D"mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz">dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz</a>
--<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><br>
<br clear=3Dall>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</body>

</html>

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-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --

--0016363b8e76a48e62049703be4a
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Well, you can argue it back and forth, but I like the way it works, and wha=
t
I am doing is giving starting players 10,000 Experience and 6 months
training time. Others can do as they please.

On 10 December 2010 13:47, R Mansfield <rmansfield@ihug.co.nz> wrote:

>  I like Stephen=92s idea, it=92s very simple and would give a start up
> character or a bunny party more options.
>
>
>
> I=92m not so keen on Jono=92s expansion of this idea for new players.  I =
have
> various thoughts on this (not all of them anti J ):
>
> 1)       I don=92t see the benefit of a new player starting with three
> characters.  They won=92t be playing in three games at once.
>
> 2)       I think the definition of new player should be having played les=
s
> than three games.  If they are still coming back after 6 months then they
> shouldn=92t need any extra bennies.
>
> 3)       In a very low game players are encouraged to roleplay their way
> through challenges as their abilities are of limited use when going by ju=
st
> the numbers.  Many of our new players have a background of computer gamin=
g
> and we need to show them the benefits of roleplaying rather than number
> crunching.
>
> 4)       I=92m not keen on 20,000 or even 10,000ep free to new players
> willy-nilly.  If they are in a bunny game then their characters will be 2=
 =96
> 3 adventures tougher than experienced players =96 which doesn=92t feel fa=
ir.
> Realistically I realise that we rarely need to run bunny level games; exc=
ept
> when we have a number of new players (established players probably only
> generate new characters every 4-6 years).
>
> 5)       I=92m comfortable with Jim=92s =9310,000exp and 6 months trainin=
g time
> =93 where a GM is fitting one or two new players into a game with establi=
shed
> players & characters.  But I think anymore than that & you loose one of t=
he
> strong DQ flavours =96 the huge influence your 1st few adventures have on
> your character.  The struggle to find creative ways to use limited abilit=
ies
> is really fun.
>
>
>
> So in summary I agree that untrained adolescents aren=92t much fun to pla=
y,
> new players need to encouraged, and being the bunny in a low game is pret=
ty
> frustrating.
>
>
>
> Cheers
>
> Rosemary
>  ------------------------------
>
> *From:* dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] *On Behalf O=
f
> *Jonathan Bean
> *Sent:* Friday, 10 December 2010 12:38 p.m.
> *To:* dq@dq.sf.org.nz
> *Subject:* Re: [DQ] Character Gen - Background Experience
>
>
>
> I think that Stephens idea goes some ways to addressing some of the issue=
s
> facing new players. In general I think its a good idea.
>
>
>
> I would like to see that thing change by allowing new players to have
> greater opportunity within DQ.
> I think this will help retain new players. I would like to see that they
> are able to start play in a low and/or med level game right away.
>
> To assist this for the period of 2011, I would like new players, to be ab=
le
> to start three characters as follows:
>
>    - One character at 2,500exp no additional training time.
>    - One character at 10,000exp and 6 months training time.
>    - One character at 20,000exp and 1 years training time.
>
>  I am defining new players as a person with only characters of less than
> 13PC.
>
> This I hope will allow for these new players to play in a range of games
> with a range of players.
>
> I expect that William Dymock-Johnson would be able to and willing to work
> with the new players to assist them.
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Jonathan Bean
>
> 39 Sackville St, Grey Lynn
> H: +64 9 376 2961
> M: +64 21 917 173
> G: jonobean@gmail.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 10 December 2010 12:08, Stephen Martin <stephenm@aklnz.net> wrote:
>
> There have been assorted discussions about the lack of fun of being
> incompetent on your first
> adventure.  It doesn't take much to become a little bit competent in a
> couple of things and be
> able to contribute a bit more to the party.
>
> Proposal: Change the Background Experience in Character Generation from 2=
50
> experience to 2,500.
>
> Current background Experience section included below for reference.
>
> Cheers, Stephen.
>
>
> Background Experience
> A character now chooses any one Artisan skill at
> Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained through
> childhood and must be appropriate to their family
> background.
> They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together
> with any left over from the non-mage generation,
> can be spent freely.
> At this time the character may acquire any one new
> skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only 100 EP (rather than
> the usual cost).
> If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for
> spending later in the game.
>
>
> -- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --
>
>
>
>
>
>

--0016363b8e76a48e62049703be4a
Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<font face=3D"georgia,serif">Well, you can argue it back and forth, but I l=
ike the way it works, and what I am doing is giving starting players 10,000=
 Experience and 6 months training time. Others can do as they please.<br></=
font><br>

<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 13:47, R Mansfield <span dir=
=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rmansfield@ihug.co.nz">rmansfield@ihug.co.nz=
</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div lang=3D"EN-GB" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"blue">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I like Stephen=
=92s idea, it=92s very simple and would give a start up character or a bunn=
y party more options.</span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I=92m not so ke=
en on Jono=92s expansion of this idea for new players.=A0 I have various th=
oughts on this (not all of them anti </span></font><font color=3D"navy" siz=
e=3D"2" face=3D"Wingdings"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Wingdings; COLOR: na=
vy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">J</span></font><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D=
"Arial"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> )=
:</span></font></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 36pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" siz=
e=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT=
-SIZE: 10pt"><span>1)<font size=3D"1" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=
=3D"FONT: 7pt &#39;Times New Roman&#39;">=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 </span></font><=
/span></span></font><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span st=
yle=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I don=92t see the =
benefit of a new player starting with three characters.=A0 They won=92t be =
playing in three games at once.</span></font></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 36pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" siz=
e=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT=
-SIZE: 10pt"><span>2)<font size=3D"1" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=
=3D"FONT: 7pt &#39;Times New Roman&#39;">=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 </span></font><=
/span></span></font><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span st=
yle=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I think the defini=
tion of new player should be having played less than three games.=A0 If the=
y are still coming back after 6 months then they shouldn=92t need any extra=
 bennies.</span></font></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 36pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" siz=
e=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT=
-SIZE: 10pt"><span>3)<font size=3D"1" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=
=3D"FONT: 7pt &#39;Times New Roman&#39;">=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 </span></font><=
/span></span></font><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span st=
yle=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">In a very low game=
 players are encouraged to roleplay their way through challenges as their a=
bilities are of limited use when going by just the numbers.=A0 Many of our =
new players have a background of computer gaming and we need to show them t=
he benefits of roleplaying rather than number crunching.</span></font></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 36pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" siz=
e=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT=
-SIZE: 10pt"><span>4)<font size=3D"1" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=
=3D"FONT: 7pt &#39;Times New Roman&#39;">=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 </span></font><=
/span></span></font><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span st=
yle=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I=92m not keen on =
20,000 or even 10,000ep free to new players willy-nilly.=A0 If they are in =
a bunny game then their characters will be 2 =96 3 adventures tougher than =
experienced players =96 which doesn=92t feel fair.=A0 Realistically I reali=
se that we rarely need to run bunny level games; except when we have a numb=
er of new players (established players probably only generate new character=
s every 4-6 years). </span></font></p>

<p style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 36pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" siz=
e=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT=
-SIZE: 10pt"><span>5)<font size=3D"1" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=
=3D"FONT: 7pt &#39;Times New Roman&#39;">=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 </span></font><=
/span></span></font><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span st=
yle=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I=92m comfortable =
with Jim=92s =9310,000exp and 6 months training time =93 where a GM is fitt=
ing one or two new players into a game with established players &amp; chara=
cters.=A0 But I think anymore than that &amp; you loose one of the strong D=
Q flavours =96 the huge influence your 1<sup>st</sup> few adventures have o=
n your character. =A0The struggle to find creative ways to use limited abil=
ities is really fun.</span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">So in summary I=
 agree that untrained adolescents aren=92t much fun to play, new players ne=
ed to encouraged, and being the bunny in a low game is pretty frustrating.<=
/span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Cheers</span></=
font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Rosemary</span>=
</font></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center"><fon=
t size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt" lang=
=3D"EN-US">
<hr align=3D"center" size=3D"2" width=3D"100%">
</span></font></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"F=
ONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-WEIGHT: bold" lang=3D"EN-US">From=
:</span></font></b><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"FONT-FAM=
ILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt" lang=3D"EN-US"> <a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq=
.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a> [mailto:<a href=3D"=
mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a>] =
<b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </span></b>Jonathan Bean<=
br>
<b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December 2=
010 12:38 p.m.<br><b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</span></b> <a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:dq@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">dq@dq.sf.org.nz</a><br><b><=
span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [DQ] Character Gen=
 - Background Experience</span></font><span lang=3D"EN-US"></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I think that Stephens idea goes some ways to addressi=
ng some of the issues facing new players. In general I think its a good ide=
a.</span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I would like to see that thing change by allowing new=
 players to have greater opportunity=A0within DQ.=A0<br>I think this will h=
elp retain new players. I would like to see that they are able to start pla=
y in a low and/or med level game right away.</span></font></p>

<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">To assist this for the period of 2011, I would like n=
ew players, to be able to start three characters as follows:</span></font><=
/p>
</div>
<div>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span sty=
le=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">One character at 2,500exp no=A0additional=A0training=
 time.=A0</span></font></li>
<li class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span sty=
le=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">One character at 10,000exp and 6 months training tim=
e.</span></font></li>
<li class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span sty=
le=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">One character at 20,000exp and 1 years training time=
.</span></font></li></ul></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I am defining new players as a person with only chara=
cters of less than 13PC.</span></font></p></div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">This I hope will allow for these new players to play =
in a range of games with a range of players.</span></font></p></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I expect that William Dymock-Johnson would be able to=
 and willing to work with the new players to assist them.</span></font></p>=
</div>

<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Kind regards,<br><br>Jonathan Bean</span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">39 Sackville St, Grey Lynn<br>H: +64 9 376 2961<br>M:=
 +64 21 917 173<br>G:=A0<a href=3D"mailto:jonobean@gmail.com" target=3D"_bl=
ank">jonobean@gmail.com</a></span></font></p>
</div></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">On 10 December 2010 12:08, Stephen Martin &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:stephenm@aklnz.net" target=3D"_blank">stephenm@aklnz.net</a>&gt;=
 wrote:</span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">There have been assorted discussions about the lack o=
f fun of being incompetent on your first<br>adventure. =A0It doesn&#39;t ta=
ke much to become a little bit competent in a couple of things and be<br>
able to contribute a bit more to the party.<br><br>Proposal: Change the Bac=
kground Experience in Character Generation from 250 experience to 2,500.<br=
><br>Current background Experience section included below for reference.<br=
>
<br>Cheers, Stephen.<br><br><br>Background Experience<br>A character now ch=
ooses any one Artisan skill at<br>Rank 0. This reflects knowledge gained th=
rough<br>childhood and must be appropriate to their family<br>background.<b=
r>
They also receive 250 Experience Points which, together<br>with any left ov=
er from the non-mage generation,<br>can be spent freely.<br>At this time th=
e character may acquire any one new<br>skill at Rank 0 for the cost of only=
 100 EP (rather than<br>
the usual cost).<br>If there is any EP remaining it may be saved for<br>spe=
nding later in the game.<br><br><br>-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:<a href=
=3D"mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">dq-request@dq.sf.org.=
nz</a> --</span></font></p>
</div>
<p style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><br><br clear=3D"all">=
<br><br></span></font></p></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:

> I am awarding new characters 10,000 Experience and six months training
> time.
>

Cool... can I play?

I am awarding new characters 20,000 Experience, 1 years training time, 3
magic items, and a new appendage of their choosing.

Next?

:)

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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Jim Arona <spa=
n dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com">jim.arona@gmail.co=
m</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margi=
n: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-le=
ft: 1ex;">
<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">I am awarding new characters 10,000 Exper=
ience and six months training time.</font></div></blockquote><div><br>Cool.=
.. can I play?<br><br>I am awarding new characters 20,000 Experience, 1 yea=
rs training time, 3 magic items, and a new appendage of their choosing.<br>
<br>Next?<br><br>:)<br></div></div>

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I'm not running a low level game at the moment, so you'd be stuck.
But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, and having ACTUALLY checked out the
effect, I'm happy with it.
As opposed to everything else which is just an untested guess on what is
workable. Are you so convinced that a rule invented without any kind of
evidentiary support and argued about by a committee is productive, Martin?
Just sounds like a recipe for delay and mediocrity to me.

On 10 December 2010 15:24, Martin Dickson <martin.dickson@gmail.com> wrote:

>  On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I am awarding new characters 10,000 Experience and six months training
>> time.
>>
>
> Cool... can I play?
>
> I am awarding new characters 20,000 Experience, 1 years training time, 3
> magic items, and a new appendage of their choosing.
>
> Next?
>
> :)
>

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<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">I&#39;m not running a low level game at t=
he moment, so you&#39;d be stuck.</font></div>
<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, and =
having ACTUALLY checked out the effect, I&#39;m happy with it. </font></div=
>
<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">As opposed to everything else which is ju=
st an untested guess on what is workable. Are you so convinced that a rule =
invented without any kind of evidentiary support and argued about by a comm=
ittee is productive, Martin? Just sounds like a recipe for delay and medioc=
rity to me.<br>
</font><br></div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 15:24, Martin Dickson <span =
dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:martin.dickson@gmail.com">martin.dickson@=
gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div class=3D"im">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Jim Arona <span dir=3D"=
ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jim.arona=
@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid; MARGIN: 0pt 0=
pt 0pt 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">I am awarding new characters 10,000 Exper=
ience and six months training time.</font></div></blockquote></div>
<div><br>Cool... can I play?<br><br>I am awarding new characters 20,000 Exp=
erience, 1 years training time, 3 magic items, and a new appendage of their=
 choosing.<br><br>Next?<br><br>:)<br></div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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Actually I have no problem with the award you are describing Jim.

I tend to think that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is
only really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in
Terranova where the party were escaped slaves... and started without even
the pointy stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-time character
generation formula and would be happy for them to start with 10k and six
months or similar.

So I'm happy that you are happy...  I'd be _happier_ if we had a standard
character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit one that could
be improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humour was just an
alternative to feeling cross, because it's not really worth that.  (Feeling
cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)

Kindest Regards,
Martin


On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm not running a low level game at the moment, so you'd be stuck.
> But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, and having ACTUALLY checked out the
> effect, I'm happy with it.
> As opposed to everything else which is just an untested guess on what is
> workable. Are you so convinced that a rule invented without any kind of
> evidentiary support and argued about by a committee is productive, Martin?
> Just sounds like a recipe for delay and mediocrity to me.
>

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Actually I have no problem with the award you are describing Jim.<br><br>I =
tend to think that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is only=
 really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in Terran=
ova where the party were escaped slaves... and started without even the poi=
nty stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-time character generation for=
mula and would be happy for them to start with 10k and six months or simila=
r.<br>
<br>So I&#39;m happy that you are happy...=A0 I&#39;d be _happier_ if we ha=
d a standard character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit =
one that could be improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humou=
r was just an alternative to feeling cross, because it&#39;s not really wor=
th that.=A0 (Feeling cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)<b=
r>
<br>Kindest Regards,<br>Martin<br><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri=
, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailt=
o:jim.arona@gmail.com">jim.arona@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockq=
uote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left:=
 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">I&#39;m not running a low level game at t=
he moment, so you&#39;d be stuck.</font></div>
<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, and =
having ACTUALLY checked out the effect, I&#39;m happy with it. </font></div=
>
<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">As opposed to everything else which is ju=
st an untested guess on what is workable. Are you so convinced that a rule =
invented without any kind of evidentiary support and argued about by a comm=
ittee is productive, Martin? Just sounds like a recipe for delay and medioc=
rity to me.</font><br>
</div></blockquote></div>

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I have been feeling a little perturbed by this conversation and trying to
get my finger on why that is.  I have uncovered a couple of things.

 

I support the idea that we want to encourage new players to join us.  I
think we are all generally in favor of this.

 

I support the notion that forcing new people to play for to long as bunnies
might not appeal to them and is likely to cause them not to meet and play
with a wide range of guild members and for this reason they might not feel
included and are quite likely not to stay around long enough get to really
enjoy the game - so I like the idea of us addressing this as an issue.

 

I don't agree with Jim that any thing has been tested and found to work.
What I have started thinking is that how fast player's progress is an
intrinsic part of the fabric of our DQ game.  Its quite central in creating
the culture of the guild the kind of players who are drawn to us the kinds
of things we value in a game.  For example we tend to try to promote role
playing as apposed to gaming, character development as opposed to powering
up etc.

 

Actually any change to this fabric wont show up for a long time.  We have
traditionally had a long term campaign style game.  Players have stayed
around for a long time and felt strongly attached to characters that they
have played for a long time and these PC's have been shaped by the game and
how we have structured it.  A new player that starts and gets 10k ep or 30k
ep and we wont know for 10 years weather this is actually a winning approach
until we find that at least some of those players are sticking around for
that long and are strongly attached to the pc's etc etc.  but also these
sorts of changes will change us as a guild and group of players - over time
the player expectations of the guild will change   Is this the direction we
have to go in so that enough people are still playing DQ that it survives?
That seems to be the notion being put forward.

 

As I think about it I am in favor of changing things slower.  I like
Stephen's proposal as a start.  I think I would add that it would be good if
players could move through the levels quicker if they wanted to.  Maybe we
could write guild tell people how to rank if they want to play medium level
games sooner.  Or provide more Ep but in smaller blocks after each
successful mission.

 

The second thing is (and I am preparing to duck as I say this) that the game
hangs together as a multi GM campaign because we endeavor to work together
to create a common world, work from common rules, apply similar standards to
players, etc.  If we don't do this we might as well just play in our own
sandpits.  I think, tedious though it is sometimes, that there are quite a
few areas that we need to endeavor to agree what we are doing as a group and
be willing to be bound by what the majority decides.  Things which affect
the whole campaign like rules and ep rewards are like this IMV.  GM's can
create what ever sorts games they want create any plains they want to play
on etc etc..but working together needs to be pretty central I think.

 

 

Hamish

 

 

 

  _____  

From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of
Martin Dickson
Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 3:24 PM
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience

 

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:

I am awarding new characters 10,000 Experience and six months training time.


Cool... can I play?

I am awarding new characters 20,000 Experience, 1 years training time, 3
magic items, and a new appendage of their choosing.

Next?

:)


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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I have been feeling a little =
perturbed by
this conversation and trying to get my finger on why that is.&nbsp; I =
have
uncovered a couple of things.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I support the idea that we want to
encourage new players to join us. &nbsp;I think we are all generally in =
favor
of this.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I support the notion that forcing =
new
people to play for to long as bunnies might not appeal to them and is =
likely to
cause them not to meet and play with a wide range of guild members and =
for this
reason they might not feel included and are quite likely not to stay =
around
long enough get to really enjoy the game &#8211; so I like the idea of =
us addressing
this as an issue.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I don&#8217;t agree with Jim that =
any
thing has been tested and found to work. &nbsp;What I have started =
thinking is
that how fast player&#8217;s progress is an intrinsic part of the fabric =
of our
DQ game.&nbsp; Its quite central in creating the culture of the guild =
the kind
of players who are drawn to us the kinds of things we value in a game. =
&nbsp;For
example we tend to try to promote role playing as apposed to gaming, =
character
development as opposed to powering up etc.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Actually any change to this fabric =
wont
show up for a long time.&nbsp; We have traditionally had a long term =
campaign style
game. &nbsp;Players have stayed around for a long time and felt strongly
attached to characters that they have played for a long time and these =
PC&#8217;s
have been shaped by the game and how we have structured it. &nbsp;A new =
player
that starts and gets 10k ep or 30k ep and we wont know for 10 years =
weather
this is actually a winning approach until we find that at least some of =
those
players are sticking around for that long and are strongly attached to =
the pc&#8217;s
etc etc&#8230;&nbsp; but also these sorts of changes will change us as a =
guild
and group of players &#8211; over time the player expectations of the =
guild
will change &nbsp;&nbsp;Is this the direction we have to go in so that =
enough
people are still playing DQ that it survives? &nbsp;That seems to be the =
notion
being put forward.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>As I think about it I am in favor =
of
changing things slower.&nbsp; I like Stephen&#8217;s proposal as a =
start. &nbsp;I
think I would add that it would be good if players could move through =
the
levels quicker if they wanted to. &nbsp;Maybe we could write guild tell =
people
how to rank if they want to play medium level games sooner. &nbsp;Or =
provide
more Ep but in smaller blocks after each successful =
mission.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The second thing is (and I am =
preparing to
duck as I say this) that the game hangs together as a multi GM campaign =
because
we endeavor to work together to create a common world, work from common =
rules,
apply similar standards to players, etc. &nbsp;If we don&#8217;t do this =
we
might as well just play in our own sandpits. &nbsp;I think, tedious =
though it
is sometimes, that there are quite a few areas that we need to endeavor =
to agree
what we are doing as a group and be willing to be bound by what the =
majority decides.
&nbsp;Things which affect the whole campaign like rules and ep rewards =
are like
this IMV. &nbsp;GM&#8217;s can create what ever sorts games they want =
create
any plains they want to play on etc etc&#8230;.but working together =
needs to be
pretty central I think.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Hamish</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p=
>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter tabindex=3D-1>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Martin Dickson<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, December =
10, 2010
3:24 PM<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] =
Character Gen -
Background Experience</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Jim Arona &lt;<a
href=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com">jim.arona@gmail.com</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Georgia'>I am awarding new characters 10,000 Experience and =
six
months training time.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
Cool... can I play?<br>
<br>
I am awarding new characters 20,000 Experience, 1 years training time, 3 =
magic
items, and a new appendage of their choosing.<br>
<br>
Next?<br>
<br>
:)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</body>

</html>

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What appendages are currently allowed? I'd like a prehensile tail.

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:24 PM, Martin Dickson <martin.dickson@gmail.com>wrote:

>  On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I am awarding new characters 10,000 Experience and six months training
>> time.
>>
>
> Cool... can I play?
>
> I am awarding new characters 20,000 Experience, 1 years training time, 3
> magic items, and a new appendage of their choosing.
>
> Next?
>
> :)
>

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What appendages are currently allowed? I&#39;d like a prehensile tail.<br><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:24 PM, Martin Dickson <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:martin.dickson@gmail.com">martin.dickson@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div class="im">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Jim Arona <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com" target="_blank">jim.arona@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid; MARGIN: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">
<div><font face="georgia,serif">I am awarding new characters 10,000 Experience and six months training time.</font></div></blockquote></div>
<div><br>Cool... can I play?<br><br>I am awarding new characters 20,000 Experience, 1 years training time, 3 magic items, and a new appendage of their choosing.<br><br>Next?<br><br>:)<br></div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 4:18 PM, RPer 4eva <msnoverflow@gmail.com> wrote:

> What appendages are currently allowed? I'd like a prehensile tail.


Where would you want it attached? :)

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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 4:18 PM, RPer 4eva <span=
 dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:msnoverflow@gmail.com">msnoverflow@gmail=
.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"ma=
rgin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding=
-left: 1ex;">
What appendages are currently allowed? I&#39;d like a prehensile tail.</blo=
ckquote><div><br>Where would you want it attached? :)<br></div></div>

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To the back of my head of course.

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 5:33 PM, Martin Dickson <martin.dickson@gmail.com>wrote:

>  On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 4:18 PM, RPer 4eva <msnoverflow@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> What appendages are currently allowed? I'd like a prehensile tail.
>
>
> Where would you want it attached? :)
>

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Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1

To the back of my head of course.<br><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 5:33 PM, Martin Dickson <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:martin.dickson@gmail.com">martin.dickson@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div class="im">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 4:18 PM, RPer 4eva <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:msnoverflow@gmail.com" target="_blank">msnoverflow@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid; MARGIN: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">What appendages are currently allowed? I&#39;d like a prehensile tail.</blockquote></div>
<div><br>Where would you want it attached? :)<br></div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Hey all,

 

I also support the ideas and I would support Jim's value as he has
experience of it.

 

I know of several GMs who have, like me, have put GM experience into a new
PC so that it is not as incompetent as current rules would require.

(I do not enjoy playing incompetent PCs nor struggling for years to develop
competence, and this is a major barrier to playing a new PC for me). 

 

Best regards,

Ian

 

  _____  

From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of
Martin Dickson
Sent: Friday, 10 December 2010 4:13 p.m.
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience

 

Actually I have no problem with the award you are describing Jim.

I tend to think that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is
only really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in
Terranova where the party were escaped slaves... and started without even
the pointy stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-time character
generation formula and would be happy for them to start with 10k and six
months or similar.

So I'm happy that you are happy...  I'd be _happier_ if we had a standard
character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit one that could
be improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humour was just an
alternative to feeling cross, because it's not really worth that.  (Feeling
cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)

Kindest Regards,
Martin



On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:

I'm not running a low level game at the moment, so you'd be stuck.

But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, and having ACTUALLY checked out the
effect, I'm happy with it. 

As opposed to everything else which is just an untested guess on what is
workable. Are you so convinced that a rule invented without any kind of
evidentiary support and argued about by a committee is productive, Martin?
Just sounds like a recipe for delay and mediocrity to me.

 

  _____  

  _____  

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3305 - Release Date: 12/09/10


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<body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue vlink=3Dblue>

<div class=3DSection1>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Hey =
all,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I also support the ideas and I =
would
support Jim&#8217;s value as he has experience of =
it.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I know of several GMs who have, =
like me, have
put GM experience into a new PC so that it is not as incompetent as =
current
rules would require.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>(I do not enjoy playing incompetent =
PCs
nor struggling for years to develop competence, and this is a major =
barrier to playing
a new PC for me). <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Best =
regards,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ian<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter tabindex=3D-1>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Martin Dickson<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December =
2010
4:13 p.m.<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] =
Character Gen -
Background Experience</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Actually I =
have no
problem with the award you are describing Jim.<br>
<br>
I tend to think that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is =
only
really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in =
Terranova
where the party were escaped slaves... and started without even the =
pointy
stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-time character generation =
formula and
would be happy for them to start with 10k and six months or similar.<br>
<br>
So I'm happy that you are happy...&nbsp; I'd be _happier_ if we had a =
standard
character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit one that =
could be
improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humour was just an
alternative to feeling cross, because it's not really worth that.&nbsp;
(Feeling cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)<br>
<br>
Kindest Regards,<br>
Martin<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona &lt;<a
href=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com">jim.arona@gmail.com</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Georgia'>I'm not running a low level game at the moment, so =
you'd
be stuck.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Georgia'>But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, and having =
ACTUALLY
checked out the effect, I'm happy with it. </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Georgia'>As opposed to everything else which is just an =
untested
guess on what is workable. Are you so convinced that a rule invented =
without
any kind of evidentiary support and argued about by a committee is =
productive,
Martin? Just sounds like a recipe for delay and mediocrity to =
me.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
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face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D1 width=3D"100%" noshade color=3D"#aca899" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3Davgcert color=3D"#000000"><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>No virus found in this message.<br>
Checked by AVG - <a href=3D"http://www.avg.com">www.avg.com</a><br>
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Umm, just tried accessing the DQWiki but can't find it... ?

Anyone know where it went?

Regards,
Karen
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<BODY lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue bgColor=3D#ffffff vLink=3Dblue>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Umm, just tried accessing the DQWiki =
but can't find=20
it... ?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Anyone know where it went?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Regards,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Karen</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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I don't see the problem with giving them 20k xp. Most people who have playe=
d
for any period of time have like half a million xp. So 20k is relativly
nothing. It doesn't detract from early character development. Wether you
have 0 or 100,000 xp before your first game its still your first game. You
can still have those epiphenies. And it is nice when people can do a few
things. Even if you put it all into one talent or spell you won't be able t=
o
get to rank 20 unless the spell is below 100 EM and you are human. Even if
they do it given these requirements how many EM 75 spells are likely to
change the game significanlt. I think its far more likely people will sprea=
d
it out.

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Ian Wood <dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz> wrote:

>  Hey all,
>
>
>
> I also support the ideas and I would support Jim=92s value as he has
> experience of it.
>
>
>
> I know of several GMs who have, like me, have put GM experience into a ne=
w
> PC so that it is not as incompetent as current rules would require.
>
> (I do not enjoy playing incompetent PCs nor struggling for years to devel=
op
> competence, and this is a major barrier to playing a new PC for me).
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Ian
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>
> *From:* dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] *On Behalf O=
f
> *Martin Dickson
> *Sent:* Friday, 10 December 2010 4:13 p.m.
>
> *To:* dq@dq.sf.org.nz
> *Subject:* Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience
>
>
>
> Actually I have no problem with the award you are describing Jim.
>
>
> I tend to think that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is
> only really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in
> Terranova where the party were escaped slaves... and started without even
> the pointy stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-time character
> generation formula and would be happy for them to start with 10k and six
> months or similar.
>
> So I'm happy that you are happy...  I'd be _happier_ if we had a standard
> character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit one that co=
uld
> be improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humour was just an
> alternative to feeling cross, because it's not really worth that.  (Feeli=
ng
> cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)
>
> Kindest Regards,
> Martin
>
>    On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote=
:
>
> I'm not running a low level game at the moment, so you'd be stuck.
>
> But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, and having ACTUALLY checked out the
> effect, I'm happy with it.
>
> As opposed to everything else which is just an untested guess on what is
> workable. Are you so convinced that a rule invented without any kind of
> evidentiary support and argued about by a committee is productive, Martin=
?
> Just sounds like a recipe for delay and mediocrity to me.
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>  ------------------------------
>
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3305 - Release Date: 12/09/10
>

--0016e64cbf6c9deb4c049707d43d
Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I don&#39;t see the problem with giving them 20k xp. Most people who have p=
layed for any period of time have like half a million xp. So 20k is relativ=
ly nothing. It doesn&#39;t detract from early character development. Wether=
 you have 0 or 100,000 xp before your first game its still your first game.=
 You can still have those epiphenies. And it is nice when people can do a f=
ew things. Even if you put it all into one talent or spell you won&#39;t be=
 able to get to rank 20 unless the spell is below 100 EM and you are human.=
 Even if they do it given these requirements how many EM 75 spells are like=
ly to change the game significanlt. I think its far more likely people will=
 spread it out.<br>
<br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Ian Wood <span =
dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz">dawnhaven@xtra.co.n=
z</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div lang=3D"EN-US" vlink=3D"blue" link=3D"blue">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Hey all,</span>=
</font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I also support =
the ideas and I would support Jim=92s value as he has experience of it.</sp=
an></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I know of sever=
al GMs who have, like me, have put GM experience into a new PC so that it i=
s not as incompetent as current rules would require.</span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">(I do not enjoy=
 playing incompetent PCs nor struggling for years to develop competence, an=
d this is a major barrier to playing a new PC for me). </span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Best regards,</=
span></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Ian</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center"><fon=
t size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<hr align=3D"center" size=3D"2" width=3D"100%">
</span></font></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"F=
ONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</span></font>=
</b><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FO=
NT-SIZE: 10pt"> <a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">=
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a> [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" =
target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a>] <b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT:=
 bold">On Behalf Of </span></b>Martin Dickson<br>
<b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December 2=
010 4:13 p.m.=20
<div class=3D"im"><br><b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</span></b> <=
a href=3D"mailto:dq@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">dq@dq.sf.org.nz</a><br>=
<b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] Character=
 Gen - Background Experience</div>
</span></font>
<p></p></p></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Actually I have no pro=
blem with the award you are describing Jim.=20
<div>
<div></div>
<div class=3D"h5"><br><br>I tend to think that starting people off with rag=
s and a pointy stick is only really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a =
game within DQ set in Terranova where the party were escaped slaves... and =
started without even the pointy stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-t=
ime character generation formula and would be happy for them to start with =
10k and six months or similar.<br>
<br>So I&#39;m happy that you are happy...=A0 I&#39;d be _happier_ if we ha=
d a standard character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit =
one that could be improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humou=
r was just an alternative to feeling cross, because it&#39;s not really wor=
th that.=A0 (Feeling cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)<b=
r>
<br>Kindest Regards,<br>Martin<br><br></div></div></span></font>
<p></p>
<div>
<div></div>
<div class=3D"h5">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona &lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jim.arona@gmail.com</a>&=
gt; wrote:</span></font></p>

<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Georgia"><span style=3D"FON=
T-FAMILY: Georgia; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I&#39;m not running a low level game at=
 the moment, so you&#39;d be stuck.</span></font></p></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Georgia"><span style=3D"FON=
T-FAMILY: Georgia; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, an=
d having ACTUALLY checked out the effect, I&#39;m happy with it. </span></f=
ont></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Georgia"><span style=3D"FON=
T-FAMILY: Georgia; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">As opposed to everything else which is =
just an untested guess on what is workable. Are you so convinced that a rul=
e invented without any kind of evidentiary support and argued about by a co=
mmittee is productive, Martin? Just sounds like a recipe for delay and medi=
ocrity to me.</span></font></p>
</div></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p></div></div>
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<hr align=3D"center" size=3D"2" width=3D"100%">
</span></font></div>
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t size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<hr align=3D"center" color=3D"#aca899" size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" noshade>
</span></font></div>
<p color=3D"#000000"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=
=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">No virus found in this message.<br>Checked by AVG - <a=
 href=3D"http://www.avg.com/" target=3D"_blank">www.avg.com</a><br>Version:=
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></p>
</p></div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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It is there but loaded slowly

 

http://www.dragonquest.org.nz/dqwiki/index.php/Main_Page

 

 

Ian

 

  _____  

From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of
Menolly
Sent: Friday, 10 December 2010 6:38 p.m.
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: [dq] Umm, where's the DQ wiki gone?

 

Umm, just tried accessing the DQWiki but can't find it... ?

 

Anyone know where it went?

 

Regards,

Karen

  _____  

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10


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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>It is there but loaded =
slowly<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>http://www.dragonquest.org.nz/dqwiki=
/index.php/Main_Page<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ian<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter tabindex=3D-1>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> =
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz
[mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On =
Behalf Of </span></b>Menolly<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December =
2010
6:38 p.m.<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> [dq] Umm, =
where's the DQ
wiki gone?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>Umm, just tried accessing the DQWiki but can't find =
it... ?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>Anyone know where it =
went?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>Regards,</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>Karen</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

</div>

</body>

<hr noshade=3D"noshade" size=3D"1"><p class=3D"avgcert" align=3D"left" =
color=3D"#000000">No virus found in this message.<br>
Checked by AVG - <a href=3D'http://www.avg.com'>www.avg.com</a><br>
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: =
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If the limit is 6 months then no talents can be ranked (no adventure time),
can get two rank 18 in two spells or rank 6 in two rituals.

Or two weapons to rank 4.

Or two skills to rank 6.

A namer can also rank one name to 18.

 

It would appear Jim's conjoined limit of ep and time works rather well. :-)

 

Ian

 

  _____  

From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of RPer
4eva
Sent: Friday, 10 December 2010 6:43 p.m.
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience

 

I don't see the problem with giving them 20k xp. Most people who have played
for any period of time have like half a million xp. So 20k is relativly
nothing. It doesn't detract from early character development. Wether you
have 0 or 100,000 xp before your first game its still your first game. You
can still have those epiphenies. And it is nice when people can do a few
things. Even if you put it all into one talent or spell you won't be able to
get to rank 20 unless the spell is below 100 EM and you are human. Even if
they do it given these requirements how many EM 75 spells are likely to
change the game significanlt. I think its far more likely people will spread
it out.

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Ian Wood <dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz> wrote:

Hey all,

 

I also support the ideas and I would support Jim's value as he has
experience of it.

 

I know of several GMs who have, like me, have put GM experience into a new
PC so that it is not as incompetent as current rules would require.

(I do not enjoy playing incompetent PCs nor struggling for years to develop
competence, and this is a major barrier to playing a new PC for me). 

 

Best regards,

Ian

 

  _____  

From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of
Martin Dickson
Sent: Friday, 10 December 2010 4:13 p.m. 


To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience

 

Actually I have no problem with the award you are describing Jim. 



I tend to think that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is
only really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in
Terranova where the party were escaped slaves... and started without even
the pointy stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-time character
generation formula and would be happy for them to start with 10k and six
months or similar.

So I'm happy that you are happy...  I'd be _happier_ if we had a standard
character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit one that could
be improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humour was just an
alternative to feeling cross, because it's not really worth that.  (Feeling
cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)

Kindest Regards,
Martin

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:

I'm not running a low level game at the moment, so you'd be stuck.

But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, and having ACTUALLY checked out the
effect, I'm happy with it. 

As opposed to everything else which is just an untested guess on what is
workable. Are you so convinced that a rule invented without any kind of
evidentiary support and argued about by a committee is productive, Martin?
Just sounds like a recipe for delay and mediocrity to me.

 

  _____  

  _____  

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/> 
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3305 - Release Date: 12/09/10

 

  _____  

  _____  

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10


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<body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue vlink=3Dblue>

<div class=3DSection1>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>If the limit is 6 months then no =
talents can
be ranked (no adventure time), can get two rank 18 in two spells or rank =
6 in
two rituals.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Or two weapons to rank =
4.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Or two skills to rank =
6.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>A namer can also rank one name to =
18.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>It would appear Jim&#8217;s =
conjoined limit of
ep and time works rather well. </span></font><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3DWingdings><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:navy'>J</span></fon=
t><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ian<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter tabindex=3D-1>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>RPer 4eva<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December =
2010
6:43 p.m.<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] =
Character Gen -
Background Experience</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>I don't see =
the problem
with giving them 20k xp. Most people who have played for any period of =
time
have like half a million xp. So 20k is relativly nothing. It doesn't =
detract
from early character development. Wether you have 0 or 100,000 xp before =
your
first game its still your first game. You can still have those =
epiphenies. And
it is nice when people can do a few things. Even if you put it all into =
one
talent or spell you won't be able to get to rank 20 unless the spell is =
below
100 EM and you are human. Even if they do it given these requirements =
how many
EM 75 spells are likely to change the game significanlt. I think its far =
more
likely people will spread it out.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Ian Wood &lt;<a
href=3D"mailto:dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz">dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div vlink=3Dblue link=3Dblue>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Hey all,</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I also support the ideas and I would support Jim&#8217;s =
value as he has
experience of it.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I know of several GMs who have, like me, have put GM =
experience
into a new PC so that it is not as incompetent as current rules would =
require.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>(I do not enjoy playing incompetent PCs nor struggling for =
years to
develop competence, and this is a major barrier to playing a new PC for =
me). </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Best regards,</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Ian</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><font
size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:
bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> <a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz"
target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a> [mailto:<a
href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" =
target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a>] <b><span
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Martin Dickson<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December =
2010
4:13 p.m. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <a
href=3D"mailto:dq@dq.sf.org.nz" =
target=3D"_blank">dq@dq.sf.org.nz</a><br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] =
Character Gen -
Background Experience<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Actually I have no
problem with the award you are describing Jim. =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><br>
<br>
I tend to think that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is =
only
really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in =
Terranova
where the party were escaped slaves... and started without even the =
pointy
stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-time character generation =
formula and
would be happy for them to start with 10k and six months or similar.<br>
<br>
So I'm happy that you are happy...&nbsp; I'd be _happier_ if we had a =
standard
character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit one that =
could be
improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humour was just an
alternative to feeling cross, because it's not really worth that.&nbsp;
(Feeling cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)<br>
<br>
Kindest Regards,<br>
Martin<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

<div>

<div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>On =
Fri, Dec 10,
2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com"
target=3D"_blank">jim.arona@gmail.com</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Georgia'>I'm not
running a low level game at the moment, so you'd be =
stuck.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Georgia'>But,
having ACTUALLY tried this out, and having ACTUALLY checked out the =
effect, I'm
happy with it. </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Georgia'>As
opposed to everything else which is just an untested guess on what is =
workable.
Are you so convinced that a rule invented without any kind of =
evidentiary
support and argued about by a committee is productive, Martin? Just =
sounds like
a recipe for delay and mediocrity to me.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

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Checked by AVG - <a href=3D"http://www.avg.com">www.avg.com</a><br>
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: =
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Blast... ok, thanks.

Regards,
Karen
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Ian Wood=20
  To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz=20
  Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 6:46 PM
  Subject: Re: [dq] Umm, where's the DQ wiki gone?


  It is there but loaded slowly

  =20

  http://www.dragonquest.org.nz/dqwiki/index.php/Main_Page

  =20

  =20

  Ian

  =20


-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----

  From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf =
Of Menolly
  Sent: Friday, 10 December 2010 6:38 p.m.
  To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
  Subject: [dq] Umm, where's the DQ wiki gone?

  =20

  Umm, just tried accessing the DQWiki but can't find it... ?

  =20

  Anyone know where it went?

  =20

  Regards,

  Karen


-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----

  No virus found in this message.
  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
  Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10


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-----

  No virus found in this message.
  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
  Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10

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<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Blast... ok, thanks.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Regards,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Karen</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"=20
dir=3Dltr>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
  <A title=3Ddawnhaven@xtra.co.nz =
href=3D"mailto:dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz">Ian Wood</A>=20
  </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=3Ddq@dq.sf.org.nz=20
  href=3D"mailto:dq@dq.sf.org.nz">dq@dq.sf.org.nz</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, December 10, 2010 =
6:46=20
  PM</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [dq] Umm, where's =
the DQ=20
  wiki gone?</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV class=3DSection1>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3Dnavy size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">It is there =
but=20
  loaded slowly<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3Dnavy size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: =
10pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3Dnavy size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.dragonquest.org.nz/dqwiki/index.php/Main_Page">http://=
www.dragonquest.org.nz/dqwiki/index.php/Main_Page</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></=
FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3Dnavy size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: =
10pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3Dnavy size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: =
10pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3Dnavy size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: =
10pt">Ian<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3Dnavy size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: =
10pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=3DMsoNormal =
align=3Dcenter><FONT size=3D3=20
  face=3D"Times New Roman"><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
  <HR tabIndex=3D-1 align=3Dcenter SIZE=3D2 width=3D"100%">
  </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><B><FONT size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-WEIGHT: =
bold">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
  size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><SPAN style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: =
10pt"> <A=20
  href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</A>=20
  [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <B><SPAN style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On =
Behalf Of=20
  </SPAN></B>Menolly<BR><B><SPAN style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: =
bold">Sent:</SPAN></B>=20
  Friday, 10 December 2010 6:38 p.m.<BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> <A=20
  href=3D"mailto:dq@dq.sf.org.nz">dq@dq.sf.org.nz</A><BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [dq] Umm, where's the =
DQ wiki=20
  gone?</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Umm, just tried =
accessing the=20
  DQWiki but can't find it... ?</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Anyone know where it=20
  went?</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: =
10pt">Regards,</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: =
10pt">Karen</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV></DIV>
  <HR SIZE=3D1 noShade>

  <P class=3Davgcert align=3Dleft color=3D"#000000">No virus found in =
this=20
  message.<BR>Checked by AVG - <A=20
  href=3D"http://www.avg.com">www.avg.com</A><BR>Version: 10.0.1170 / =
Virus=20
  Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10</P>
  <HR SIZE=3D1 noShade>

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this=20
  message.<BR>Checked by AVG - <A=20
  href=3D"http://www.avg.com">www.avg.com</A><BR>Version: 10.0.1170 / =
Virus=20
  Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: =
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I'm not sure one could get 2 spells to 18 with 20k xp or get a name to 18. =
I
thought names took a week per rank. As in rank 1 takes a week and rank 2
takes 2 more weeks. So in six months a name could be raised to 6 taking 21
weeks. Not 18. If this is wrong then I appologise and will be showing up to
my next game with much much higher ranks in names.

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:53 PM, Ian Wood <dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz> wrote:

>  If the limit is 6 months then no talents can be ranked (no adventure
> time), can get two rank 18 in two spells or rank 6 in two rituals.
>
> Or two weapons to rank 4.
>
> Or two skills to rank 6.
>
> A namer can also rank one name to 18.
>
>
>
> It would appear Jim=92s conjoined limit of ep and time works rather well.=
 J
>
>
>
> Ian
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>
> *From:* dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] *On Behalf O=
f
> *RPer 4eva
> *Sent:* Friday, 10 December 2010 6:43 p.m.
>
> *To:* dq@dq.sf.org.nz
> *Subject:* Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience
>
>
>
> I don't see the problem with giving them 20k xp. Most people who have
> played for any period of time have like half a million xp. So 20k is
> relativly nothing. It doesn't detract from early character development.
> Wether you have 0 or 100,000 xp before your first game its still your fir=
st
> game. You can still have those epiphenies. And it is nice when people can=
 do
> a few things. Even if you put it all into one talent or spell you won't b=
e
> able to get to rank 20 unless the spell is below 100 EM and you are human=
.
> Even if they do it given these requirements how many EM 75 spells are lik=
ely
> to change the game significanlt. I think its far more likely people will
> spread it out.
>
> On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Ian Wood <dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
>
> Hey all,
>
>
>
> I also support the ideas and I would support Jim=92s value as he has
> experience of it.
>
>
>
> I know of several GMs who have, like me, have put GM experience into a ne=
w
> PC so that it is not as incompetent as current rules would require.
>
> (I do not enjoy playing incompetent PCs nor struggling for years to devel=
op
> competence, and this is a major barrier to playing a new PC for me).
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Ian
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>
> *From:* dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] *On Behalf O=
f
> *Martin Dickson
> *Sent:* Friday, 10 December 2010 4:13 p.m.
>
>
> *To:* dq@dq.sf.org.nz
> *Subject:* Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience
>
>
>
> Actually I have no problem with the award you are describing Jim.
>
>
>
> I tend to think that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is
> only really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in
> Terranova where the party were escaped slaves... and started without even
> the pointy stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-time character
> generation formula and would be happy for them to start with 10k and six
> months or similar.
>
> So I'm happy that you are happy...  I'd be _happier_ if we had a standard
> character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit one that co=
uld
> be improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humour was just an
> alternative to feeling cross, because it's not really worth that.  (Feeli=
ng
> cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)
>
> Kindest Regards,
> Martin
>
> On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I'm not running a low level game at the moment, so you'd be stuck.
>
> But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, and having ACTUALLY checked out the
> effect, I'm happy with it.
>
> As opposed to everything else which is just an untested guess on what is
> workable. Are you so convinced that a rule invented without any kind of
> evidentiary support and argued about by a committee is productive, Martin=
?
> Just sounds like a recipe for delay and mediocrity to me.
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>  ------------------------------
>
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3305 - Release Date: 12/09/10
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>  ------------------------------
>
>  No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10
>
>

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I&#39;m not sure one could get 2 spells to 18 with 20k xp or get a name to =
18. I thought names took a week per rank. As in rank 1 takes a week and ran=
k 2 takes 2 more weeks. So in six months a name could be raised to=A06 taki=
ng=A021 weeks. Not 18. If this is wrong then I appologise and will be showi=
ng up to my next game with much much higher ranks in names.<br>
<br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:53 PM, Ian Wood <span =
dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz">dawnhaven@xtra.co.n=
z</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div lang=3D"EN-US" vlink=3D"blue" link=3D"blue">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">If the limit is=
 6 months then no talents can be ranked (no adventure time), can get two ra=
nk 18 in two spells or rank 6 in two rituals.</span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Or two weapons =
to rank 4.</span></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Or two skills t=
o rank 6.</span></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">A namer can als=
o rank one name to 18.</span></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">It would appear=
 Jim=92s conjoined limit of ep and time works rather well. </span></font><f=
ont color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Wingdings"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY=
: Wingdings; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">J</span></font><font color=3D"na=
vy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: nav=
y; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"></span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Ian</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center"><fon=
t size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<hr align=3D"center" size=3D"2" width=3D"100%">
</span></font></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"F=
ONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</span></font>=
</b><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FO=
NT-SIZE: 10pt"> <a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">=
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a> [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" =
target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a>] <b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT:=
 bold">On Behalf Of </span></b>RPer 4eva<br>
<b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December 2=
010 6:43 p.m.=20
<div>
<div></div>
<div class=3D"h5"><br><b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</span></b> <=
a href=3D"mailto:dq@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">dq@dq.sf.org.nz</a><br>=
<b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] Character=
 Gen - Background Experience</div>
</div></span></font>
<p></p></p></div>
<div>
<div></div>
<div class=3D"h5">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I don&#39;t see the pr=
oblem with giving them 20k xp. Most people who have played for any period o=
f time have like half a million xp. So 20k is relativly nothing. It doesn&#=
39;t detract from early character development. Wether you have 0 or 100,000=
 xp before your first game its still your first game. You can still have th=
ose epiphenies. And it is nice when people can do a few things. Even if you=
 put it all into one talent or spell you won&#39;t be able to get to rank 2=
0 unless the spell is below 100 EM and you are human. Even if they do it gi=
ven these requirements how many EM 75 spells are likely to change the game =
significanlt. I think its far more likely people will spread it out.</span>=
</font></p>

<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Ian Wood &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz" target=3D"_blank">dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz</a>=
&gt; wrote:</span></font></p>

<div vlink=3D"blue" link=3D"blue">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Hey all,</span>=
</font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I also support =
the ideas and I would support Jim=92s value as he has experience of it.</sp=
an></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I know of sever=
al GMs who have, like me, have put GM experience into a new PC so that it i=
s not as incompetent as current rules would require.</span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">(I do not enjoy=
 playing incompetent PCs nor struggling for years to develop competence, an=
d this is a major barrier to playing a new PC for me). </span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Best regards,</=
span></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Ian</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center"><fon=
t size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<hr align=3D"center" size=3D"2" width=3D"100%">
</span></font></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"F=
ONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</span></font>=
</b><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FO=
NT-SIZE: 10pt"> <a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">=
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a> [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" =
target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a>] <b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT:=
 bold">On Behalf Of </span></b>Martin Dickson<br>
<b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December 2=
010 4:13 p.m. </span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"FONT=
-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><br><b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">=
To:</span></b> <a href=3D"mailto:dq@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">dq@dq.s=
f.org.nz</a><br>
<b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] Character=
 Gen - Background Experience</span></font></p></div></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p>
<p style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Actually I have no pro=
blem with the award you are describing Jim. </span></font></p>
<div>
<div>
<p style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><br><br>I tend to thin=
k that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is only really fun =
if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in Terranova where th=
e party were escaped slaves... and started without even the pointy stick --=
 but is kinda boring as the every-time character generation formula and wou=
ld be happy for them to start with 10k and six months or similar.<br>
<br>So I&#39;m happy that you are happy...=A0 I&#39;d be _happier_ if we ha=
d a standard character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit =
one that could be improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humou=
r was just an alternative to feeling cross, because it&#39;s not really wor=
th that.=A0 (Feeling cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)<b=
r>
<br>Kindest Regards,<br>Martin</span></font></p></div></div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona &lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jim.arona@gmail.com</a>&=
gt; wrote:</span></font></p>

<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Georgia"><span style=3D"FON=
T-FAMILY: Georgia; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I&#39;m not running a low level game at=
 the moment, so you&#39;d be stuck.</span></font></p></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Georgia"><span style=3D"FON=
T-FAMILY: Georgia; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, an=
d having ACTUALLY checked out the effect, I&#39;m happy with it. </span></f=
ont></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Georgia"><span style=3D"FON=
T-FAMILY: Georgia; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">As opposed to everything else which is =
just an untested guess on what is workable. Are you so convinced that a rul=
e invented without any kind of evidentiary support and argued about by a co=
mmittee is productive, Martin? Just sounds like a recipe for delay and medi=
ocrity to me.</span></font></p>
</div></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p></div></div>
<div style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center"><fon=
t size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<hr align=3D"center" size=3D"2" width=3D"100%">
</span></font></div>
<div style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center"><fon=
t size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<hr align=3D"center" color=3D"#aca899" size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" noshade>
</span></font></div>
<p color=3D"#000000"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=
=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">No virus found in this message.<br>Checked by AVG - <a=
 href=3D"http://www.avg.com/" target=3D"_blank">www.avg.com</a><br>Version:=
 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3305 - Release Date: 12/09/10</span></font=
></p>
</div></div></div>
<p style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=
=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p>
<div style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center"><fon=
t size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<hr align=3D"center" size=3D"2" width=3D"100%">
</span></font></div>
<div style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center"><fon=
t size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<hr align=3D"center" color=3D"#aca899" size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" noshade>
</span></font></div></div></div>
<p color=3D"#000000"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=
=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<div>
<div></div>
<div class=3D"h5">No virus found in this message.<br>Checked by AVG - <a hr=
ef=3D"http://www.avg.com/" target=3D"_blank">www.avg.com</a><br></div></div=
>Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10</sp=
an></font>=20
<p></p></p></div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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Oops, my bad

 

Ian

 

  _____  

From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of RPer
4eva
Sent: Friday, 10 December 2010 7:11 p.m.
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience

 

I'm not sure one could get 2 spells to 18 with 20k xp or get a name to 18. I
thought names took a week per rank. As in rank 1 takes a week and rank 2
takes 2 more weeks. So in six months a name could be raised to 6 taking 21
weeks. Not 18. If this is wrong then I appologise and will be showing up to
my next game with much much higher ranks in names.

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:53 PM, Ian Wood <dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz> wrote:

If the limit is 6 months then no talents can be ranked (no adventure time),
can get two rank 18 in two spells or rank 6 in two rituals.

Or two weapons to rank 4.

Or two skills to rank 6.

A namer can also rank one name to 18.

 

It would appear Jim's conjoined limit of ep and time works rather well. :-)

 

Ian

 

  _____  

From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of RPer
4eva
Sent: Friday, 10 December 2010 6:43 p.m. 


To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience

 

I don't see the problem with giving them 20k xp. Most people who have played
for any period of time have like half a million xp. So 20k is relativly
nothing. It doesn't detract from early character development. Wether you
have 0 or 100,000 xp before your first game its still your first game. You
can still have those epiphenies. And it is nice when people can do a few
things. Even if you put it all into one talent or spell you won't be able to
get to rank 20 unless the spell is below 100 EM and you are human. Even if
they do it given these requirements how many EM 75 spells are likely to
change the game significanlt. I think its far more likely people will spread
it out.

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Ian Wood <dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz> wrote:

Hey all,

 

I also support the ideas and I would support Jim's value as he has
experience of it.

 

I know of several GMs who have, like me, have put GM experience into a new
PC so that it is not as incompetent as current rules would require.

(I do not enjoy playing incompetent PCs nor struggling for years to develop
competence, and this is a major barrier to playing a new PC for me). 

 

Best regards,

Ian

 

  _____  

From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of
Martin Dickson
Sent: Friday, 10 December 2010 4:13 p.m. 


To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience

 

Actually I have no problem with the award you are describing Jim. 



I tend to think that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is
only really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in
Terranova where the party were escaped slaves... and started without even
the pointy stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-time character
generation formula and would be happy for them to start with 10k and six
months or similar.

So I'm happy that you are happy...  I'd be _happier_ if we had a standard
character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit one that could
be improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humour was just an
alternative to feeling cross, because it's not really worth that.  (Feeling
cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)

Kindest Regards,
Martin

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:

I'm not running a low level game at the moment, so you'd be stuck.

But, having ACTUALLY tried this out, and having ACTUALLY checked out the
effect, I'm happy with it. 

As opposed to everything else which is just an untested guess on what is
workable. Are you so convinced that a rule invented without any kind of
evidentiary support and argued about by a committee is productive, Martin?
Just sounds like a recipe for delay and mediocrity to me.

 

  _____  

  _____  

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/> 
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3305 - Release Date: 12/09/10

 

  _____  

  _____  

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/> 

Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10 

 

  _____  

  _____  

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10


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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Oops, my =
bad<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Ian<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter tabindex=3D-1>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>RPer 4eva<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December =
2010
7:11 p.m.<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] =
Character Gen -
Background Experience</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>I'm not sure =
one could
get 2 spells to 18 with 20k xp or get a name to 18. I thought names took =
a week
per rank. As in rank 1 takes a week and rank 2 takes 2 more weeks. So in =
six
months a name could be raised to&nbsp;6 taking&nbsp;21 weeks. Not 18. If =
this
is wrong then I appologise and will be showing up to my next game with =
much
much higher ranks in names.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 6:53 PM, Ian Wood &lt;<a
href=3D"mailto:dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz">dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div vlink=3Dblue link=3Dblue>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>If the limit is 6 months then no talents can be ranked (no
adventure time), can get two rank 18 in two spells or rank 6 in two =
rituals.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Or two weapons to rank 4.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Or two skills to rank 6.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>A namer can also rank one name to =
18.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>It would appear Jim&#8217;s conjoined limit of ep and time =
works rather
well. </span></font><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DWingdings><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:navy'>J</span></fon=
t><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Ian</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><font
size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:
bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> <a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz"
target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a> [mailto:<a
href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" =
target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a>] <b><span
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>RPer 4eva<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December =
2010
6:43 p.m. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <a
href=3D"mailto:dq@dq.sf.org.nz" =
target=3D"_blank">dq@dq.sf.org.nz</a><br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] =
Character Gen -
Background Experience<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

</div>

<div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>I =
don't see the
problem with giving them 20k xp. Most people who have played for any =
period of
time have like half a million xp. So 20k is relativly nothing. It =
doesn't
detract from early character development. Wether you have 0 or 100,000 =
xp
before your first game its still your first game. You can still have =
those
epiphenies. And it is nice when people can do a few things. Even if you =
put it
all into one talent or spell you won't be able to get to rank 20 unless =
the
spell is below 100 EM and you are human. Even if they do it given these
requirements how many EM 75 spells are likely to change the game =
significanlt.
I think its far more likely people will spread it =
out.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>On =
Fri, Dec 10,
2010 at 6:00 PM, Ian Wood &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz"
target=3D"_blank">dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div vlink=3Dblue link=3Dblue>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Hey all,</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I also support the ideas and I would support Jim&#8217;s =
value as he has
experience of it.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I know of several GMs who have, like me, have put GM =
experience
into a new PC so that it is not as incompetent as current rules would =
require.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>(I do not enjoy playing incompetent PCs nor struggling for =
years to
develop competence, and this is a major barrier to playing a new PC for =
me). </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Best regards,</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>Ian</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><font
size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:
bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> <a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz"
target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a> [mailto:<a
href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" =
target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a>] <b><span
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Martin Dickson<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, 10 December =
2010
4:13 p.m. </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <a
href=3D"mailto:dq@dq.sf.org.nz" =
target=3D"_blank">dq@dq.sf.org.nz</a><br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] =
Character Gen -
Background Experience</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Actually I have no
problem with the award you are describing Jim. =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><br>
<br>
I tend to think that starting people off with rags and a pointy stick is =
only
really fun if being done for cause -- I ran a game within DQ set in =
Terranova
where the party were escaped slaves... and started without even the =
pointy
stick -- but is kinda boring as the every-time character generation =
formula and
would be happy for them to start with 10k and six months or similar.<br>
<br>
So I'm happy that you are happy...&nbsp; I'd be _happier_ if we had a =
standard
character generation system... which I thought we did, albeit one that =
could be
improved... and my silly response / poor attempt at humour was just an
alternative to feeling cross, because it's not really worth that.&nbsp;
(Feeling cross over something Jim does in DQ is so 1990s). :)<br>
<br>
Kindest Regards,<br>
Martin<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

<div>

<div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>On =
Fri, Dec 10,
2010 at 3:34 PM, Jim Arona &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com"
target=3D"_blank">jim.arona@gmail.com</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Georgia'>I'm not
running a low level game at the moment, so you'd be =
stuck.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Georgia'>But,
having ACTUALLY tried this out, and having ACTUALLY checked out the =
effect, I'm
happy with it. </span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Georgia'>As
opposed to everything else which is just an untested guess on what is =
workable.
Are you so convinced that a rule invented without any kind of =
evidentiary
support and argued about by a committee is productive, Martin? Just =
sounds like
a recipe for delay and mediocrity to me.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D1 width=3D"100%" noshade color=3D"#aca899" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

<p color=3D"#000000"><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>No virus found in this message.<br>
Checked by AVG - <a href=3D"http://www.avg.com/" =
target=3D"_blank">www.avg.com</a><br>
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3305 - Release Date: =
12/09/10<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D1 width=3D"100%" noshade color=3D"#aca899" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

</div>

</div>

<div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal color=3D"#000000"><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>No virus found in this message.<br>
Checked by AVG - <a href=3D"http://www.avg.com/" =
target=3D"_blank">www.avg.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: =
12/09/10 <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D1 width=3D"100%" noshade color=3D"#aca899" align=3Dcenter>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3Davgcert color=3D"#000000"><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>No virus found in this message.<br>
Checked by AVG - <a href=3D"http://www.avg.com">www.avg.com</a><br>
Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: =
12/09/10<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</body>

</html>

------=_NextPart_000_0056_01CB989E.A4DD91B0--


-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --

It was off-line for a while but is better now.

Be nice to it, it's an old server and is starting to have senior moments.

On Fri, December 10, 2010 7:01 pm, Menolly wrote:
> Blast... ok, thanks.
>
> Regards,
> Karen
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: Ian Wood
>   To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
>   Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 6:46 PM
>   Subject: Re: [dq] Umm, where's the DQ wiki gone?
>
>
>   It is there but loaded slowly
>
>
>
>   http://www.dragonquest.org.nz/dqwiki/index.php/Main_Page
>
>
>
>
>
>   Ian
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>   From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of Menolly
>   Sent: Friday, 10 December 2010 6:38 p.m.
>   To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
>   Subject: [dq] Umm, where's the DQ wiki gone?
>
>
>
>   Umm, just tried accessing the DQWiki but can't find it... ?
>
>
>
>   Anyone know where it went?
>
>
>
>   Regards,
>
>   Karen
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>   No virus found in this message.
>   Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>   Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>   No virus found in this message.
>   Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>   Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10
>


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On 26/11/2010 11:05 a.m., mhyoung@ihug.co.nz wrote:
> Howdy Aqualina,
> I'll take a dozen or 20 Waters of Healing if you can make that many. I
> don't need any emergency rations thanks.
>
>    
Can do 20 ..... which PC is this for?

Aqualina


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Menolly wrote:
> Sunday buses suck, is there anyone going through Onehunga on their way 
> to Guild meeting that I could beg a lift from? I was hoping to go to 
> the lunch thing afterwards so I can get home ok... it's just the 
> getting there that's a bit tricky. Help?
>  
We sort of go through Onehunga - the Queenstown Rd off-ramp, up the hill 
and up Pah Rd. Dunno if that's any help.

Jacqui


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Anybody else want restoratives?

Grizelda the Giantess Witch


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--00163646da746d11d0049708e568
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

On 10 December 2010 19:47, Jacqui Smith <flamis@ihug.co.nz> wrote:

> Anybody else want restoratives?
>
> Grizelda the Giantess Witch
>

Sitting outside the Guild pub, Lath looks up after spending few hours
cleaning the dried blood from some blue boots.
So Witch how strong can you make these magic potions? and can you change the
flavour?

Lath


-- 
Kind regards,

Jonathan Bean
39 Sackville St, Grey Lynn
H: +64 9 376 2961
M: +64 21 917 173
G: jonobean@gmail.com

--00163646da746d11d0049708e568
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 19:47, Jacqui Smith =
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:flamis@ihug.co.nz">flamis@ihug.co.n=
z</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margi=
n:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
Anybody else want restoratives?<br>
<br>
Grizelda the Giantess Witch<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Sitting out=
side the Guild pub, Lath looks up after spending few hours cleaning the dri=
ed blood from some blue boots.</div><div>So Witch how strong can you make t=
hese magic potions? and can you change the flavour?</div>
<div><br></div><div>Lath</div><div><br></div><div>=A0</div></div>-- <br>Kin=
d regards,<br><br>Jonathan Bean<div>39 Sackville St, Grey Lynn<br>H: +64 9 =
376 2961<br>M: +64 21 917 173<br>G: <a href=3D"mailto:jonobean@gmail.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">jonobean@gmail.com</a></div>
<br>

--00163646da746d11d0049708e568--


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--0016363b8e767d5efd0497090035
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We do not yet have to have a central committee with  agents of enforcement
goose stepping behind them in serried rows who enforce a particular type of
game.
Every game, whatever fantasy world you inhabit, is a step into a different
reality. If you want to play in a given DM's game, you accept the rules and
constraints that they use. If you don't, you play somewhere else. The share=
d
world concept is a debased notion, partly because

   - the amount of information generation per game is too great.
   - a DM would have to be interested in keeping up with it.

I certainly have better things to do with my time. Sure, I might make use o=
f
some information I come across in a general way, but I'm not going to work
my way through the entire scribe notes list just to give a player a deeper
sense of reality. The same applies to rules.
No one pays DM to run their game, we do it for fun. When it stops being fun=
,
it seems hard to imagine why else we would continue to run them.
And, at the moment, there aren't enough DMs.
Hell, I can't think of a time when that wasn't true.


On 10 December 2010 16:16, Hamish Brown <perfect_brown@xtra.co.nz> wrote:


>  I think, tedious though it is sometimes, that there are quite a few area=
s
> that we need to endeavor to agree what we are doing as a group and be
> willing to be bound by what the majority decides.  Things which affect th=
e
> whole campaign like rules and ep rewards are like this IMV.  GM=92s can c=
reate
> what ever sorts games they want create any plains they want to play on et=
c
> etc=85.but working together needs to be pretty central I think.
>
>
>
>
>
> Hamish
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>
> *From:* dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] *On Behalf O=
f
> *Martin Dickson
> *Sent:* Friday, December 10, 2010 3:24 PM
> *To:* dq@dq.sf.org.nz
> *Subject:* Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I am awarding new characters 10,000 Experience and six months training
> time.
>
> Cool... can I play?
>
> I am awarding new characters 20,000 Experience, 1 years training time, 3
> magic items, and a new appendage of their choosing.
>
> Next?
>
> :)
>

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<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif"></font><font face=3D"georgia,serif">We </=
font><font face=3D"georgia,serif">do not yet=A0have to have a central commi=
ttee=A0with =A0agents of enforcement goose stepping behind them in serried =
rows who enforce a particular type of game. </font></div>

<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">Every game, whatever fantasy world you in=
habit, is a step into a different reality. If you want to play in=A0a given=
=A0DM&#39;s game, you accept the rules and constraints that they=A0use. If =
you don&#39;t, you play somewhere else. The shared world concept is a debas=
ed notion, partly because</font></div>

<ul>
<li><font face=3D"georgia,serif">the amount of information generation per g=
ame is too great.</font></li>
<li><font face=3D"georgia,serif">a DM would have to be interested in keepin=
g up with it.</font></li></ul>
<div>I certainly have better things to do with my time. Sure, I might make =
use of some=A0information I come across in a general way, but I&#39;m not g=
oing to work my way through the entire scribe notes list just to give a pla=
yer a deeper sense of reality. The same applies to rules. </div>

<div>No one pays DM to run their game, we do it for fun. When it stops bein=
g fun, it seems hard to imagine why else we=A0would continue to run them.</=
div>
<div>And, at the moment, there aren&#39;t enough DMs. </div>
<div>Hell, I can&#39;t think of a time when that wasn&#39;t true.</div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 16:16, Hamish Brown <span di=
r=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:perfect_brown@xtra.co.nz">perfect_brown@xtr=
a.co.nz</a>&gt;</span> wrote:=20
<div>=A0</div>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"blue">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I think, tediou=
s though it is sometimes, that there are quite a few areas that we need to =
endeavor to agree what we are doing as a group and be willing to be bound b=
y what the majority decides. =A0Things which affect the whole campaign like=
 rules and ep rewards are like this IMV. =A0GM=92s can create what ever sor=
ts games they want create any plains they want to play on etc etc=85.but wo=
rking together needs to be pretty central I think.</span></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Hamish</span></=
font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Calibri"><sp=
an style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Calibri; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span><=
/font></p></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font color=3D"navy" size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"><span=
 style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; COLOR: navy; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">=A0</span></fon=
t></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"TEXT-ALIGN: center" class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center"><fon=
t size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<hr align=3D"center" size=3D"2" width=3D"100%">
</span></font></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"F=
ONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</span></font>=
</b><font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><span style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; FO=
NT-SIZE: 10pt"> <a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">=
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a> [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz" =
target=3D"_blank">dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz</a>] <b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT:=
 bold">On Behalf Of </span></b>Martin Dickson=20
<div><b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</span></b> Friday, December=
 10, 2010 3:24 PM</div>
<div><b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</span></b> <a href=3D"mailto:=
dq@dq.sf.org.nz" target=3D"_blank">dq@dq.sf.org.nz</a></div>
<div><b><span style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] Char=
acter Gen - Background Experience</div></span></font></p></div></div>
<div class=3D"im">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">=A0</span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Jim Arona &lt;<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jim.arona@gmail.com</a>=
&gt; wrote:</span></font></p>

<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Georgia"><span style=3D"FON=
T-FAMILY: Georgia; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I am awarding new characters 10,000 Exp=
erience and six months training time.</span></font></p></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"3" face=3D"Times New Roman"><span styl=
e=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<div>Cool... can I play?</div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div>I am awarding new characters 20,000 Experience, 1 years training time,=
 3 magic items, and a new appendage of their choosing.</div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div>Next?</div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div>:)</div></span></font></p></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div>
<div>=A0</div>

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I am interested in getting a new player up and running with a character on
the first night they play. More than 10,000 Experience and 6 months training
time leads them to spending an awfully long time trying to work out the best
way to spend it.
10K means that they get a couple of spells up to around Rk 6-8, or maybe a
Skill or weapon up to 3 or 4. It doesn't let them advance stats or talents,
although they could advance a ritual, but aside from Purification, there's
not much out there worth worrying about on your first adventure.
I have no idea what epiphanies you are referring to, and I suspect I might
be horrified if you explain. Frankly, my reasons are a lot less mystical. I
just want the player to have a vehicle that lets them engage in the game.
That's because players that are doing things are having one hell of a lot
more fun than players waiting to have the curses removed from backfiring to
Hell and gone.

On 10 December 2010 18:43, RPer 4eva <msnoverflow@gmail.com> wrote:

> I don't see the problem with giving them 20k xp. Most people who have
> played for any period of time have like half a million xp. So 20k is
> relativly nothing. It doesn't detract from early character development.
> Wether you have 0 or 100,000 xp before your first game its still your first
> game. You can still have those epiphenies. And it is nice when people can do
> a few things. Even if you put it all into one talent or spell you won't be
> able to get to rank 20 unless the spell is below 100 EM and you are human.
> Even if they do it given these requirements how many EM 75 spells are likely
> to change the game significanlt. I think its far more likely people will
> spread it out.
>
>
>
>

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<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">I am interested in getting a new player u=
p and running with a character on the first night they play. More than 10,0=
00 Experience and 6 months training time leads them to spending an awfully =
long time trying to work out the best way to spend it.</font></div>

<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">10K means that they get a couple of spell=
s up to around Rk 6-8, or maybe a Skill or weapon up to 3 or 4. It doesn&#3=
9;t let them advance stats or talents, although they could advance a ritual=
, but aside from Purification, there&#39;s not much out there worth worryin=
g about on your first adventure.</font></div>

<div><font face=3D"georgia,serif">I have no idea what epiphanies you are re=
ferring to, and I suspect I might be horrified if you explain. Frankly, my =
reasons are a lot less mystical. I just want the player to have a vehicle t=
hat lets them engage in the game. That&#39;s=A0because players that are doi=
ng things are having one hell of a lot more fun than players waiting to hav=
e the curses removed from backfiring to Hell and gone.<br>
</font><br></div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 18:43, RPer 4eva <span dir=
=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:msnoverflow@gmail.com">msnoverflow@gmail.com=
</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">I don&#39;t see the problem with=
 giving them 20k xp. Most people who have played for any period of time hav=
e like half a million xp. So 20k is relativly nothing. It doesn&#39;t detra=
ct from early character development. Wether you have 0 or 100,000 xp before=
 your first game its still your first game. You can still have those epiphe=
nies. And it is nice when people can do a few things. Even if you put it al=
l into one talent or spell you won&#39;t be able to get to rank 20 unless t=
he spell is below 100 EM and you are human. Even if they do it given these =
requirements how many EM 75 spells are likely to change the game significan=
lt. I think its far more likely people will spread it out.=20
<div>
<div></div>
<div class=3D"h5"><br><br>=A0</div></div></blockquote></div>

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10K and 6 mths does sound quite balanced.

 

Enough to get the PC going but not enough that they skip being low, or have
to rank skills that they don't know how to use.

 

Hamish

 

 

  _____  

From: dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] On Behalf Of Jim
Arona
Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 8:16 PM
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Subject: Re: [dq] Character Gen - Background Experience

 

I am interested in getting a new player up and running with a character on
the first night they play. More than 10,000 Experience and 6 months training
time leads them to spending an awfully long time trying to work out the best
way to spend it.

10K means that they get a couple of spells up to around Rk 6-8, or maybe a
Skill or weapon up to 3 or 4. It doesn't let them advance stats or talents,
although they could advance a ritual, but aside from Purification, there's
not much out there worth worrying about on your first adventure.

I have no idea what epiphanies you are referring to, and I suspect I might
be horrified if you explain. Frankly, my reasons are a lot less mystical. I
just want the player to have a vehicle that lets them engage in the game.
That's because players that are doing things are having one hell of a lot
more fun than players waiting to have the curses removed from backfiring to
Hell and gone.

On 10 December 2010 18:43, RPer 4eva <msnoverflow@gmail.com> wrote:

I don't see the problem with giving them 20k xp. Most people who have played
for any period of time have like half a million xp. So 20k is relativly
nothing. It doesn't detract from early character development. Wether you
have 0 or 100,000 xp before your first game its still your first game. You
can still have those epiphenies. And it is nice when people can do a few
things. Even if you put it all into one talent or spell you won't be able to
get to rank 20 unless the spell is below 100 EM and you are human. Even if
they do it given these requirements how many EM 75 spells are likely to
change the game significanlt. I think its far more likely people will spread
it out. 



 


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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>10K and 6 mths does sound quite =
balanced.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Enough to get the PC going but not =
enough
that they skip being low, or have to rank skills that they don&#8217;t =
know how
to use.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Hamish<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p=
>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>

<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter tabindex=3D-1>

</span></font></div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz [mailto:dq-owner@dq.sf.org.nz] <b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:
bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Jim Arona<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Friday, December =
10, 2010
8:16 PM<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName =
w:st=3D"on">dq@dq.sf.org.nz</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [dq] =
Character Gen -
Background Experience</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Georgia'>I am interested in getting a new player up and =
running
with a character on the first night they play. More than 10,000 =
Experience and
6 months training time leads them to spending an awfully long time =
trying to
work out the best way to spend it.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3DGeorgia><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:Georgia'>10K means that they get a couple of spells up to =
around Rk
6-8, or maybe a Skill or weapon up to 3 or 4. It doesn't let them =
advance stats
or talents, although they could advance a ritual, but aside from =
Purification,
there's not much out there worth worrying about on your first =
adventure.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D3 =
face=3DGeorgia><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Georgia'>I have no idea what =
epiphanies you
are referring to, and I suspect I might be horrified if you explain. =
Frankly,
my reasons are a lot less mystical. I just want the player to have a =
vehicle
that lets them engage in the game. That's&nbsp;because players that are =
doing
things are having one hell of a lot more fun than players waiting to =
have the
curses removed from backfiring to Hell and =
gone.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>On 10 December 2010 18:43, RPer 4eva &lt;<a
href=3D"mailto:msnoverflow@gmail.com">msnoverflow@gmail.com</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>I don't see the problem with giving them 20k xp. Most people who =
have
played for any period of time have like half a million xp. So 20k is =
relativly
nothing. It doesn't detract from early character development. Wether you =
have 0
or 100,000 xp before your first game its still your first game. You can =
still
have those epiphenies. And it is nice when people can do a few things. =
Even if
you put it all into one talent or spell you won't be able to get to rank =
20
unless the spell is below 100 EM and you are human. Even if they do it =
given
these requirements how many EM 75 spells are likely to change the game
significanlt. I think its far more likely people will spread it out. =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<div>

<div>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
<br>
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

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Dalran

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 7:39 PM, Keith Smith <phaeton@ihug.co.nz> wrote:

> On 26/11/2010 11:05 a.m., mhyoung@ihug.co.nz wrote:
>
>> Howdy Aqualina,
>> I'll take a dozen or 20 Waters of Healing if you can make that many. I
>> don't need any emergency rations thanks.
>>
>>
>>
> Can do 20 ..... which PC is this for?
>
> Aqualina
>
>
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Dalran<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 7:39 PM, K=
eith Smith <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:phaeton@ihug.co.nz">phae=
ton@ihug.co.nz</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" s=
tyle=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204=
); padding-left: 1ex;">
On 26/11/2010 11:05 a.m., <a href=3D"mailto:mhyoung@ihug.co.nz" target=3D"_=
blank">mhyoung@ihug.co.nz</a> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; borde=
r-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
Howdy Aqualina,<br>
I&#39;ll take a dozen or 20 Waters of Healing if you can make that many. I<=
br>
don&#39;t need any emergency rations thanks.<br>
<br>
 =A0 <br>
</blockquote>
Can do 20 ..... which PC is this for?<br>
<br>
Aqualina<br>
<br>
<br>
-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:dq-pub-request@dq.sf.org.=
nz" target=3D"_blank">dq-pub-request@dq.sf.org.nz</a> --<br>
</blockquote></div><br>

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> Dalran

Ooops .... that message was actually meant for MTB .... yours are ready for
pickup or delivery.

Aqualina


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Can you animate them so they follow behind you in a little line?

On 10 December 2010 20:36, <phaeton@ihug.co.nz> wrote:

>
> > Dalran
>
> Ooops .... that message was actually meant for MTB .... yours are ready for
> pickup or delivery.
>
> Aqualina
>
>
> -- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-pub-request@dq.sf.org.nz --
>

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<font face="georgia,serif">Can you animate them so they follow behind you in a little line?<br></font><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 20:36, <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:phaeton@ihug.co.nz">phaeton@ihug.co.nz</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote"><br>&gt; Dalran<br><br>Ooops .... that message was actually meant for MTB .... yours are ready for<br>pickup or delivery.<br>

<div>
<div></div>
<div class="h5"><br>Aqualina<br><br><br>-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:<a href="mailto:dq-pub-request@dq.sf.org.nz">dq-pub-request@dq.sf.org.nz</a> --<br></div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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The problem is one of design philosophy. Dragonquest was one of the first
RPGs when characters were concieved as starting right at the start of their
adventuring careers and progressing from there. Progression initially would
be relatively rapid and then level out as they became competant.

Gaming moved on. Most later games started PCs as already competant. Somehow
those games did not suffer from not having new characters unable to confront
an irate housecat but rather plunged them into high stakes action from the
start.

The best approach was the use of 'archetypes' best seen in games like
Shadowrun, Vampire and Star Wars. Character gen too complex, confusing or
squeezed in-between endless wanking about how much roleplaying the game was
about (Vampire, I'm looking at you)? Use one of the character archetypes at
the back of the book.

The archetype consisted of some concept art, a brief character description
and some starting stats already worked out. Well, a vast amount of boring
exposition if it was Vampire, but never mind they had the right idea.

This is what I propose we have for new players. New characters with a stats
/ skills already worked out for them. This saves all the time spent trying
to generate a new PC, it's there. You don't have to worry about it being
min-maxed, it's already there. Hopefully we'll be able to get them online so
it's a simple matter of select and print. Easy.

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<div><br><br>The problem is one of design philosophy. Dragonquest was one o=
f the first RPGs when characters were concieved as starting right at the st=
art of their adventuring careers and progressing from there. Progression in=
itially would be relatively rapid and then level out as they became competa=
nt.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>Gaming moved on. Most later games started PCs as already competant. So=
mehow those games did not suffer from not having new characters unable to c=
onfront an irate housecat but rather plunged them into high stakes action f=
rom the start.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The best approach was the use of &#39;archetypes&#39; best seen in gam=
es like Shadowrun, Vampire and Star Wars. Character gen too complex, confus=
ing or squeezed in-between endless wanking about how much roleplaying the g=
ame was about (Vampire, I&#39;m looking at you)? Use one of the character a=
rchetypes at the back of the book. </div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The archetype consisted of some concept art, a brief character descrip=
tion and some starting stats already worked out. Well, a vast amount of bor=
ing exposition if it was Vampire, but never mind they had the right idea.</=
div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>This is what I propose we have for new players. New characters with a =
stats / skills already worked out for them. This saves all the time spent t=
rying to generate a new PC, it&#39;s there. You don&#39;t have to worry abo=
ut it being min-maxed, it&#39;s already there. Hopefully we&#39;ll be able =
to get them online so it&#39;s a simple matter of select and print. Easy.</=
div>

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I would like to see it tried, but I'm not much interested in having an
option where a new player can enter a medium+ level game.

On 10 December 2010 20:40, William Dymock-Johnson <
dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> The problem is one of design philosophy. Dragonquest was one of the first
> RPGs when characters were concieved as starting right at the start of their
> adventuring careers and progressing from there. Progression initially would
> be relatively rapid and then level out as they became competant.
>
> Gaming moved on. Most later games started PCs as already competant. Somehow
> those games did not suffer from not having new characters unable to confront
> an irate housecat but rather plunged them into high stakes action from the
> start.
>
> The best approach was the use of 'archetypes' best seen in games like
> Shadowrun, Vampire and Star Wars. Character gen too complex, confusing or
> squeezed in-between endless wanking about how much roleplaying the game was
> about (Vampire, I'm looking at you)? Use one of the character archetypes at
> the back of the book.
>
> The archetype consisted of some concept art, a brief character description
> and some starting stats already worked out. Well, a vast amount of boring
> exposition if it was Vampire, but never mind they had the right idea.
>
> This is what I propose we have for new players. New characters with a stats
> / skills already worked out for them. This saves all the time spent trying
> to generate a new PC, it's there. You don't have to worry about it being
> min-maxed, it's already there. Hopefully we'll be able to get them online so
> it's a simple matter of select and print. Easy.
>

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<font face=3D"georgia,serif">I would like to see it tried, but I&#39;m not =
much interested in having an option where a new player can enter a medium+ =
level game.<br></font><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 20:40, William Dymock-Johnso=
n <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com">d=
ymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div><br><br>The problem is one of design philosophy. Dragonquest was one o=
f the first RPGs when characters were concieved as starting right at the st=
art of their adventuring careers and progressing from there. Progression in=
itially would be relatively rapid and then level out as they became competa=
nt.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>Gaming moved on. Most later games started PCs as already competant. So=
mehow those games did not suffer from not having new characters unable to c=
onfront an irate housecat but rather plunged them into high stakes action f=
rom the start.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The best approach was the use of &#39;archetypes&#39; best seen in gam=
es like Shadowrun, Vampire and Star Wars. Character gen too complex, confus=
ing or squeezed in-between endless wanking about how much roleplaying the g=
ame was about (Vampire, I&#39;m looking at you)? Use one of the character a=
rchetypes at the back of the book. </div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The archetype consisted of some concept art, a brief character descrip=
tion and some starting stats already worked out. Well, a vast amount of bor=
ing exposition if it was Vampire, but never mind they had the right idea.</=
div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>This is what I propose we have for new players. New characters with a =
stats / skills already worked out for them. This saves all the time spent t=
rying to generate a new PC, it&#39;s there. You don&#39;t have to worry abo=
ut it being min-maxed, it&#39;s already there. Hopefully we&#39;ll be able =
to get them online so it&#39;s a simple matter of select and print. Easy.</=
div>
</blockquote></div><br>

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No panic. Dean around the orad is giving me a lift. Thanks for the offer.

Regards,
Karen

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jacqui Smith" <flamis@ihug.co.nz>
To: <dq@dq.sf.org.nz>
Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 7:46 PM
Subject: Re: [dq] (OT) can anyone give me a lift to Guild meeting please?


> Menolly wrote:
>> Sunday buses suck, is there anyone going through Onehunga on their way 
>> to Guild meeting that I could beg a lift from? I was hoping to go to 
>> the lunch thing afterwards so I can get home ok... it's just the 
>> getting there that's a bit tricky. Help?
>>  
> We sort of go through Onehunga - the Queenstown Rd off-ramp, up the hill 
> and up Pah Rd. Dunno if that's any help.
> 
> Jacqui
> 
> 
> -- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --
> 
> 
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3306 - Release Date: 12/09/10
>


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On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 8:57 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:

> I would like to see it tried, but I'm not much interested in having an
> option where a new player can enter a medium+ level game.
>
> On 10 December 2010 20:40, William Dymock-Johnson <
> dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> The problem is one of design philosophy. Dragonquest was one of the first
>> RPGs when characters were concieved as starting right at the start of their
>> adventuring careers and progressing from there. Progression initially would
>> be relatively rapid and then level out as they became competant.
>>
>> Gaming moved on. Most later games started PCs as already competant.
>> Somehow those games did not suffer from not having new characters unable to
>> confront an irate housecat but rather plunged them into high stakes action
>> from the start.
>>
>> The best approach was the use of 'archetypes' best seen in games like
>> Shadowrun, Vampire and Star Wars. Character gen too complex, confusing or
>> squeezed in-between endless wanking about how much roleplaying the game was
>> about (Vampire, I'm looking at you)? Use one of the character archetypes at
>> the back of the book.
>>
>> The archetype consisted of some concept art, a brief character description
>> and some starting stats already worked out. Well, a vast amount of boring
>> exposition if it was Vampire, but never mind they had the right idea.
>>
>> This is what I propose we have for new players. New characters with a
>> stats / skills already worked out for them. This saves all the time spent
>> trying to generate a new PC, it's there. You don't have to worry about it
>> being min-maxed, it's already there. Hopefully we'll be able to get them
>> online so it's a simple matter of select and print. Easy.
>>
>
> My idea atm is low-level characters of about 20,000 xp

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<br><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 8:57 PM, Jim Arona <span=
 dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com">jim.arona@gmail.com=
</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0=
px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid"><font face=3D"georgia,serif">I w=
ould like to see it tried, but I&#39;m not much interested in having an opt=
ion where a new player can enter a medium+ level game.<br>
</font>
<div>
<div></div>
<div class=3D"h5"><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 20:40, William Dymock-Johnso=
n <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0=
px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<div><br><br>The problem is one of design philosophy. Dragonquest was one o=
f the first RPGs when characters were concieved as starting right at the st=
art of their adventuring careers and progressing from there. Progression in=
itially would be relatively rapid and then level out as they became competa=
nt.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>Gaming moved on. Most later games started PCs as already competant. So=
mehow those games did not suffer from not having new characters unable to c=
onfront an irate housecat but rather plunged them into high stakes action f=
rom the start.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The best approach was the use of &#39;archetypes&#39; best seen in gam=
es like Shadowrun, Vampire and Star Wars. Character gen too complex, confus=
ing or squeezed in-between endless wanking about how much roleplaying the g=
ame was about (Vampire, I&#39;m looking at you)? Use one of the character a=
rchetypes at the back of the book. </div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The archetype consisted of some concept art, a brief character descrip=
tion and some starting stats already worked out. Well, a vast amount of bor=
ing exposition if it was Vampire, but never mind they had the right idea.</=
div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>This is what I propose we have for new players. New characters with a =
stats / skills already worked out for them. This saves all the time spent t=
rying to generate a new PC, it&#39;s there. You don&#39;t have to worry abo=
ut it being min-maxed, it&#39;s already there. Hopefully we&#39;ll be able =
to get them online so it&#39;s a simple matter of select and print. Easy.</=
div>
</blockquote></div><br></div></div></blockquote></div>
<div>My idea atm is low-level characters of about 20,000 xp</div>
<div><br>=A0</div>

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Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

I love it.

On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 9:07 PM, William Dymock-Johnson <
dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 8:57 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I would like to see it tried, but I'm not much interested in having an
>> option where a new player can enter a medium+ level game.
>>
>> On 10 December 2010 20:40, William Dymock-Johnson <
>> dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The problem is one of design philosophy. Dragonquest was one of the first
>>> RPGs when characters were concieved as starting right at the start of their
>>> adventuring careers and progressing from there. Progression initially would
>>> be relatively rapid and then level out as they became competant.
>>>
>>> Gaming moved on. Most later games started PCs as already competant.
>>> Somehow those games did not suffer from not having new characters unable to
>>> confront an irate housecat but rather plunged them into high stakes action
>>> from the start.
>>>
>>> The best approach was the use of 'archetypes' best seen in games like
>>> Shadowrun, Vampire and Star Wars. Character gen too complex, confusing or
>>> squeezed in-between endless wanking about how much roleplaying the game was
>>> about (Vampire, I'm looking at you)? Use one of the character archetypes at
>>> the back of the book.
>>>
>>> The archetype consisted of some concept art, a brief character
>>> description and some starting stats already worked out. Well, a vast amount
>>> of boring exposition if it was Vampire, but never mind they had the right
>>> idea.
>>>
>>> This is what I propose we have for new players. New characters with a
>>> stats / skills already worked out for them. This saves all the time spent
>>> trying to generate a new PC, it's there. You don't have to worry about it
>>> being min-maxed, it's already there. Hopefully we'll be able to get them
>>> online so it's a simple matter of select and print. Easy.
>>>
>>
>> My idea atm is low-level characters of about 20,000 xp
>
>
>

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I love it.<br><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 9:07 PM, William Dymock-=
Johnson <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.=
com">dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div>
<div></div>
<div class=3D"h5"><br><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 8:57 PM, Jim Arona <span=
 dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">j=
im.arona@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote"><font face=3D"georgia,serif">I w=
ould like to see it tried, but I&#39;m not much interested in having an opt=
ion where a new player can enter a medium+ level game.<br>
</font>
<div>
<div></div>
<div><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 20:40, William Dymock-Johnso=
n <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div><br><br>The problem is one of design philosophy. Dragonquest was one o=
f the first RPGs when characters were concieved as starting right at the st=
art of their adventuring careers and progressing from there. Progression in=
itially would be relatively rapid and then level out as they became competa=
nt.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>Gaming moved on. Most later games started PCs as already competant. So=
mehow those games did not suffer from not having new characters unable to c=
onfront an irate housecat but rather plunged them into high stakes action f=
rom the start.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The best approach was the use of &#39;archetypes&#39; best seen in gam=
es like Shadowrun, Vampire and Star Wars. Character gen too complex, confus=
ing or squeezed in-between endless wanking about how much roleplaying the g=
ame was about (Vampire, I&#39;m looking at you)? Use one of the character a=
rchetypes at the back of the book. </div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The archetype consisted of some concept art, a brief character descrip=
tion and some starting stats already worked out. Well, a vast amount of bor=
ing exposition if it was Vampire, but never mind they had the right idea.</=
div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>This is what I propose we have for new players. New characters with a =
stats / skills already worked out for them. This saves all the time spent t=
rying to generate a new PC, it&#39;s there. You don&#39;t have to worry abo=
ut it being min-maxed, it&#39;s already there. Hopefully we&#39;ll be able =
to get them online so it&#39;s a simple matter of select and print. Easy.</=
div>
</blockquote></div><br></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div>
<div>My idea atm is low-level characters of about 20,000 xp</div>
<div><br>=A0</div></blockquote></div><br>

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I'm sure that reassures William

On 10 December 2010 21:17, RPer 4eva <msnoverflow@gmail.com> wrote:

> I love it.
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 9:07 PM, William Dymock-Johnson <
> dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 8:57 PM, Jim Arona <jim.arona@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I would like to see it tried, but I'm not much interested in having an
>>> option where a new player can enter a medium+ level game.
>>>
>>> On 10 December 2010 20:40, William Dymock-Johnson <
>>> dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The problem is one of design philosophy. Dragonquest was one of the
>>>> first RPGs when characters were concieved as starting right at the start of
>>>> their adventuring careers and progressing from there. Progression initially
>>>> would be relatively rapid and then level out as they became competant.
>>>>
>>>> Gaming moved on. Most later games started PCs as already competant.
>>>> Somehow those games did not suffer from not having new characters unable to
>>>> confront an irate housecat but rather plunged them into high stakes action
>>>> from the start.
>>>>
>>>> The best approach was the use of 'archetypes' best seen in games like
>>>> Shadowrun, Vampire and Star Wars. Character gen too complex, confusing or
>>>> squeezed in-between endless wanking about how much roleplaying the game was
>>>> about (Vampire, I'm looking at you)? Use one of the character archetypes at
>>>> the back of the book.
>>>>
>>>> The archetype consisted of some concept art, a brief character
>>>> description and some starting stats already worked out. Well, a vast amount
>>>> of boring exposition if it was Vampire, but never mind they had the right
>>>> idea.
>>>>
>>>> This is what I propose we have for new players. New characters with a
>>>> stats / skills already worked out for them. This saves all the time spent
>>>> trying to generate a new PC, it's there. You don't have to worry about it
>>>> being min-maxed, it's already there. Hopefully we'll be able to get them
>>>> online so it's a simple matter of select and print. Easy.
>>>>
>>>
>>> My idea atm is low-level characters of about 20,000 xp
>>
>>
>>
>
>

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<font face=3D"georgia,serif">I&#39;m sure that reassures William<br></font>=
<br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 21:17, RPer 4eva <span dir=
=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:msnoverflow@gmail.com">msnoverflow@gmail.com=
</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">I love it.=20
<div>
<div></div>
<div class=3D"h5"><br><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 9:07 PM, William Dymock-=
Johnson <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.=
com" target=3D"_blank">dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:=
<br>

<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div>
<div></div>
<div><br><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 8:57 PM, Jim Arona <span=
 dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jim.arona@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">j=
im.arona@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote"><font face=3D"georgia,serif">I w=
ould like to see it tried, but I&#39;m not much interested in having an opt=
ion where a new player can enter a medium+ level game.<br>
</font>
<div>
<div></div>
<div><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 10 December 2010 20:40, William Dymock-Johnso=
n <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">dymockjohnsonwilliam@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div><br><br>The problem is one of design philosophy. Dragonquest was one o=
f the first RPGs when characters were concieved as starting right at the st=
art of their adventuring careers and progressing from there. Progression in=
itially would be relatively rapid and then level out as they became competa=
nt.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>Gaming moved on. Most later games started PCs as already competant. So=
mehow those games did not suffer from not having new characters unable to c=
onfront an irate housecat but rather plunged them into high stakes action f=
rom the start.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The best approach was the use of &#39;archetypes&#39; best seen in gam=
es like Shadowrun, Vampire and Star Wars. Character gen too complex, confus=
ing or squeezed in-between endless wanking about how much roleplaying the g=
ame was about (Vampire, I&#39;m looking at you)? Use one of the character a=
rchetypes at the back of the book. </div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The archetype consisted of some concept art, a brief character descrip=
tion and some starting stats already worked out. Well, a vast amount of bor=
ing exposition if it was Vampire, but never mind they had the right idea.</=
div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>This is what I propose we have for new players. New characters with a =
stats / skills already worked out for them. This saves all the time spent t=
rying to generate a new PC, it&#39;s there. You don&#39;t have to worry abo=
ut it being min-maxed, it&#39;s already there. Hopefully we&#39;ll be able =
to get them online so it&#39;s a simple matter of select and print. Easy.</=
div>
</blockquote></div><br></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div>
<div>My idea atm is low-level characters of about 20,000 xp</div>
<div><br>=A0</div></blockquote></div><br></div></div></blockquote></div><br=
>

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