--0016e649c8f8618d97049b2a0f96
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

It is very pleasing to see all the replies, mostly saying "ditch it".

I totally agree :-)

Ian's point sums it up : this is supposed to be a game not a simulation.

How about putting it to the vote?

On 29 January 2011 23:53, Helen Saggers <helen@darksoft.co.nz> wrote:

>
>
> I=92m with Ian Wood, If we are going to =93fix it=94 let=92s just do so b=
y doing
> away with the dam thing.
>
> In the interests of tree conservation and saving printer ink here is how =
I
> handle the differing SC on a printed character sheet.
>
> Thorn my Master Warrior/Healer  has trained in some 30+ different weapons=
.
> For 11 of these weapons her Healers tactile empathy penalty may change or
> may not apply depending on whether the weapon is used in close, melee or =
at
> range. My solution was not another column or another line on the characte=
r
> sheet but to work out how the weapon was most likely to be used and
> calculate the SC to that usage. Then I note to which of the 2 or 3 uses t=
he
> SC is calculated to by making the letter visibly different (its bold) on =
the
> use column of my Character sheet, so that I know in 5 yrs time which use =
its
> calculating the SC based on and how to adjust it if I do something
> different... like throw a Battle Axe at someone not multi-hex strike them=
.
>
> E.g. A Dagger is mostly a close weapon for someone who regularly uses a
> hand & =BD sword even though it can be used at Range in Melee or Close, s=
o my
> character sheet has under use RM*C. *Then come game time I use my sword
> (SC calc=92d for melee) until I get into close and then swap to the dagge=
r and
> use the numbers on the sheet. If I somehow end up in a melee Dagger fight=
 or
> choose to disarm myself by throwing the thing for some reason then I can
> adjust the SC accordingly.
>
> The thing is while a character may have the skill to use many weapons the=
y
> are creatures of habit, they usually only regularly use 3 or 4 weapons, a=
nd
> they mostly use then the same way,...e.g. Bow for Range, Battle Axe for
> melee, Dagger or Unarmed for close, so they only need the one set of SC f=
or
> 90% of the time.
>
> Helen
>

--0016e649c8f8618d97049b2a0f96
Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

It is very pleasing to see all the replies, mostly saying &quot;ditch it&qu=
ot;.=A0 <br><br>I totally agree :-)<br><br>Ian&#39;s point sums it up : thi=
s is supposed to be a game not a simulation.<br><br>How about putting it to=
 the vote?<br>
<br>On 29 January 2011 23:53, Helen Saggers <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:helen@darksoft.co.nz">helen@darksoft.co.nz</a>&gt;</span> wrote:=
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">









<div bgcolor=3D"white" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-NZ">

<div>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">=A0</=
span></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"color:=
#1F497D">I=92m
with Ian Wood, If we are going to =93fix it=94 let=92s just do so
by doing away with the dam thing.</span></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"color:=
#1F497D">In
the interests of tree conservation and saving printer ink here is how I han=
dle
the differing SC on a printed character sheet.</span></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Thorn my Master Warrior/Healer=A0 has trained in =
some 30+
different weapons. For 11 of these weapons her Healers tactile empathy pena=
lty
may change or may not apply depending on whether the weapon is used in clos=
e,
melee or at range. My solution was not another column or another line on th=
e character
sheet but to work out how the weapon was most likely to be used and calcula=
te
the SC to that usage. Then I note to which of the 2 or 3 uses the SC is cal=
culated
to by making the letter visibly different (its bold) on the use column of m=
y
Character sheet, so that I know in 5 yrs time which use its calculating the=
 SC
based on and how to adjust it if I do something different... like throw a B=
attle
Axe at someone not multi-hex strike them.</span></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">E.g. A Dagger is mostly a close weapon for someon=
e who regularly
uses a hand &amp; =BD sword even though it can be used at Range in Melee or=
 Close,
so my character sheet has under use RM<b>C. </b>Then come game time I use m=
y
sword (SC calc=92d for melee) until I get into close and then swap to the
dagger and use the numbers on the sheet. If I somehow end up in a melee Dag=
ger
fight or choose to disarm myself by throwing the thing for some reason then=
 I
can adjust the SC accordingly.</span></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">The thing is while a character may have the skill=
 to use many weapons
they are creatures of habit, they usually only regularly use 3 or 4 weapons=
,
and they mostly use then the same way,...e.g. Bow for Range, Battle Axe for
melee, Dagger or Unarmed for close, so they only need the one set of SC for=
 90%
of the time.</span></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Helen</span></p>

</div>

</div>


</blockquote></div><br>

--0016e649c8f8618d97049b2a0f96--


-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --

--001636416b0f049855049b2a6233
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Vote: if you want a vote put it on the agenda for the gods meeting for the
next guild meeting. If you are after the change writeup all the details, an=
d
come along and talk about it. Point out its a minor change and attempt to
get it moved into play before the next rulebook pprinting (since its minor)=
.

Kind regard
Jono

On 1/02/2011 9:14 AM, "Neil Davies" <nsdavies@gmail.com> wrote:

It is very pleasing to see all the replies, mostly saying "ditch it".

I totally agree :-)

Ian's point sums it up : this is supposed to be a game not a simulation.

How about putting it to the vote?



On 29 January 2011 23:53, Helen Saggers <helen@darksoft.co.nz> wrote:
>
>
>
> I=92m with Ian Wood,...

--001636416b0f049855049b2a6233
Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<p>Vote: if you want a vote put it on the agenda for the gods meeting for t=
he next guild meeting. If you are after the change writeup all the details,=
 and come along and talk about it. Point out its a minor change and attempt=
 to get it moved into play before the next rulebook pprinting (since its mi=
nor).</p>

<p>Kind regard<br>
Jono<br>
</p>
<p><blockquote type=3D"cite">On 1/02/2011 9:14 AM, &quot;Neil Davies&quot; =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:nsdavies@gmail.com">nsdavies@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:=
<br><br>It is very pleasing to see all the replies, mostly saying &quot;dit=
ch it&quot;.=A0 <br>
<br>I totally agree :-)<br><br>Ian&#39;s point sums it up : this is suppose=
d to be a game not a simulation.<br><br>How about putting it to the vote?<p=
><font color=3D"#500050"><br><br>On 29 January 2011 23:53, Helen Saggers &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:helen@darksoft.co.nz">helen@darksoft.co.nz</a>&gt; wrot=
e:<br>
&gt;<br>&gt; =A0<br>&gt;<br>&gt; I=92m with Ian Wood,...</font></p></blockq=
uote></p>

--001636416b0f049855049b2a6233--


-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --

--00163683369cb0aa45049b2af8dc
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Do people want to talk about changing the current DQ 'face to face' voting
at gods meetings, to a different voting system?

I ask this because every so often people almost bring it up, from time to
time.

Kind regards
Jono

--00163683369cb0aa45049b2af8dc
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1

<p>Do people want to talk about changing the current DQ &#39;face to face&#39; voting at gods meetings, to a different voting system?</p>
<p>I ask this because every so often people almost bring it up, from time to time.</p>
<p>Kind regards<br>
Jono<br>
</p>

--00163683369cb0aa45049b2af8dc--


-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --

--0016e64cbb30d1d16b049b2df8cc
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

The alternative being online voting?

On 1 February 2011 10:19, Jonathan Bean <jonobean@gmail.com> wrote:

> Do people want to talk about changing the current DQ 'face to face' voting
> at gods meetings, to a different voting system?
>
> I ask this because every so often people almost bring it up, from time to
> time.
>
> Kind regards
> Jono
>

--0016e64cbb30d1d16b049b2df8cc
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1

<font face="georgia,serif">The alternative being online voting?<br></font><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 1 February 2011 10:19, Jonathan Bean <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:jonobean@gmail.com">jonobean@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">
<p>Do people want to talk about changing the current DQ &#39;face to face&#39; voting at gods meetings, to a different voting system?</p>
<p>I ask this because every so often people almost bring it up, from time to time.</p>
<p>Kind regards<br>Jono<br></p></blockquote></div><br>

--0016e64cbb30d1d16b049b2df8cc--


-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --

--0-870249407-1296537506=:83884
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Much as I'm for simplicity, ditching the SC penelty means there is no reaso=
n to not take Non Tactile Empathy.

As, per the healer rules....

You can always do tactile empathy by touch.
Non tactile grants you 1 more ability.=C2=A0 The ability to sense someones =
surface emotions at a range.=C2=A0 Not a very big ability, and non tactile =
doesn't actually let you use any healer abilities at range as per the curre=
nt rules in the book, but it doesn't cost you anything other than a higher =
strike chance penelty.

So if the penelty is removed, suddenly there is no cost for taking non tact=
ile empathy compared to tactile empathy.

From Bernard Hoggins
=0Anevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk

--- On Tue, 1/2/11, Neil Davies <nsdavies@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Neil Davies <nsdavies@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Received: Tuesday, 1 February, 2011, 9:14 AM

It is very pleasing to see all the replies, mostly saying "ditch it".=C2=A0=
=20

I totally agree :-)

Ian's point sums it up : this is supposed to be a game not a simulation.

How about putting it to the vote?
=0A
On 29 January 2011 23:53, Helen Saggers <helen@darksoft.co.nz> wrote:
=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=C2=A0=0A=0AI=E2=80=99m=0Awith Ia=
n Wood, If we are going to =E2=80=9Cfix it=E2=80=9D let=E2=80=99s just do s=
o=0Aby doing away with the dam thing.=0A=0AIn=0Athe interests of tree conse=
rvation and saving printer ink here is how I handle=0Athe differing SC on a=
 printed character sheet.=0A=0AThorn my Master Warrior/Healer=C2=A0 has tra=
ined in some 30+=0Adifferent weapons. For 11 of these weapons her Healers t=
actile empathy penalty=0Amay change or may not apply depending on whether t=
he weapon is used in close,=0Amelee or at range. My solution was not anothe=
r column or another line on the character=0Asheet but to work out how the w=
eapon was most likely to be used and calculate=0Athe SC to that usage. Then=
 I note to which of the 2 or 3 uses the SC is calculated=0Ato by making the=
 letter visibly different (its bold) on the use column of my=0ACharacter sh=
eet, so that I know in 5 yrs time which use its calculating the SC=0Abased =
on and how to adjust it if I do something different... like throw a Battle=
=0AAxe at someone not multi-hex strike them.=0A=0AE.g. A Dagger is mostly a=
 close weapon for someone who regularly=0Auses a hand & =C2=BD sword even t=
hough it can be used at Range in Melee or Close,=0Aso my character sheet ha=
s under use RMC. Then come game time I use my=0Asword (SC calc=E2=80=99d fo=
r melee) until I get into close and then swap to the=0Adagger and use the n=
umbers on the sheet. If I somehow end up in a melee Dagger=0Afight or choos=
e to disarm myself by throwing the thing for some reason then I=0Acan adjus=
t the SC accordingly.=0A=0AThe thing is while a character may have the skil=
l to use many weapons=0Athey are creatures of habit, they usually only regu=
larly use 3 or 4 weapons,=0Aand they mostly use then the same way,...e.g. B=
ow for Range, Battle Axe for=0Amelee, Dagger or Unarmed for close, so they =
only need the one set of SC for 90%=0Aof the time.=0A=0AHelen=0A=0A=0A=0A=
=0A=0A=0A
=0A=0A=0A=0A      
--0-870249407-1296537506=:83884
Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<table cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" border=3D"0" ><tr><td valign=3D"=
top" style=3D"font: inherit;">Much as I'm for simplicity, ditching the SC p=
enelty means there is no reason to not take Non Tactile Empathy.<br><br>As,=
 per the healer rules....<br><br>You can always do tactile empathy by touch=
.<br>Non tactile grants you 1 more ability.&nbsp; The ability to sense some=
ones surface emotions at a range.&nbsp; Not a very big ability, and non tac=
tile doesn't actually let you use any healer abilities at range as per the =
current rules in the book, but it doesn't cost you anything other than a hi=
gher strike chance penelty.<br><br>So if the penelty is removed, suddenly t=
here is no cost for taking non tactile empathy compared to tactile empathy.=
<br><br>From Bernard Hoggins<br>=0Anevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk<br><br>--- On <b>Tu=
e, 1/2/11, Neil Davies <i>&lt;nsdavies@gmail.com&gt;</i></b> wrote:<br><blo=
ckquote style=3D"border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px;=
 padding-left: 5px;"><br>From: Neil Davies &lt;nsdavies@gmail.com&gt;<br>Su=
bject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty<br>To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>Received: Tuesd=
ay, 1 February, 2011, 9:14 AM<br><br><div id=3D"yiv681277569">It is very pl=
easing to see all the replies, mostly saying "ditch it".&nbsp; <br><br>I to=
tally agree :-)<br><br>Ian's point sums it up : this is supposed to be a ga=
me not a simulation.<br><br>How about putting it to the vote?<br>=0A<br>On =
29 January 2011 23:53, Helen Saggers <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a rel=3D"nofoll=
ow" ymailto=3D"mailto:helen@darksoft.co.nz" target=3D"_blank" href=3D"/mc/c=
ompose?to=3Dhelen@darksoft.co.nz">helen@darksoft.co.nz</a>&gt;</span> wrote=
:<br><div class=3D"yiv681277569gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"yiv6812775=
69gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid r=
gb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A<div l=
ang=3D"EN-NZ">=0A=0A<div>=0A=0A<p class=3D"yiv681277569MsoNormal"><span sty=
le=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span></p>=0A=0A<p =
class=3D"yiv681277569MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style=
=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I=E2=80=99m=0Awith Ian Wood, If we are going =
to =E2=80=9Cfix it=E2=80=9D let=E2=80=99s just do so=0Aby doing away with t=
he dam thing.</span></p>=0A=0A<p class=3D"yiv681277569MsoNormal" style=3D"m=
argin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">In=0Athe inte=
rests of tree conservation and saving printer ink here is how I handle=0Ath=
e differing SC on a printed character sheet.</span></p>=0A=0A<p class=3D"yi=
v681277569MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style=3D"font-siz=
e: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Thorn my Master Warrior/Healer&nbsp; has=
 trained in some 30+=0Adifferent weapons. For 11 of these weapons her Heale=
rs tactile empathy penalty=0Amay change or may not apply depending on wheth=
er the weapon is used in close,=0Amelee or at range. My solution was not an=
other column or another line on the character=0Asheet but to work out how t=
he weapon was most likely to be used and calculate=0Athe SC to that usage. =
Then I note to which of the 2 or 3 uses the SC is calculated=0Ato by making=
 the letter visibly different (its bold) on the use column of my=0ACharacte=
r sheet, so that I know in 5 yrs time which use its calculating the SC=0Aba=
sed on and how to adjust it if I do something different... like throw a Bat=
tle=0AAxe at someone not multi-hex strike them.</span></p>=0A=0A<p class=3D=
"yiv681277569MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style=3D"font-=
size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">E.g. A Dagger is mostly a close weapo=
n for someone who regularly=0Auses a hand &amp; =C2=BD sword even though it=
 can be used at Range in Melee or Close,=0Aso my character sheet has under =
use RM<b>C. </b>Then come game time I use my=0Asword (SC calc=E2=80=99d for=
 melee) until I get into close and then swap to the=0Adagger and use the nu=
mbers on the sheet. If I somehow end up in a melee Dagger=0Afight or choose=
 to disarm myself by throwing the thing for some reason then I=0Acan adjust=
 the SC accordingly.</span></p>=0A=0A<p class=3D"yiv681277569MsoNormal" sty=
le=3D"margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);">The thing is while a character may have the skill to use many we=
apons=0Athey are creatures of habit, they usually only regularly use 3 or 4=
 weapons,=0Aand they mostly use then the same way,...e.g. Bow for Range, Ba=
ttle Axe for=0Amelee, Dagger or Unarmed for close, so they only need the on=
e set of SC for 90%=0Aof the time.</span></p>=0A=0A<p class=3D"yiv681277569=
MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; c=
olor: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Helen</span></p>=0A=0A</div>=0A=0A</div>=0A=0A=0A<=
/blockquote></div><br>=0A</div></blockquote></td></tr></table><br>=0A=0A=0A=
=0A      &nbsp;
--0-870249407-1296537506=:83884--


-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --

--0-1120442675-1296541768=:87099
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

i thought there was a fatigue cost for non-tactile option (which counts eve=
n if you are touching.
=C2=A0
I would make that mean the healer who chose the=C2=A0non-tactile empathy op=
tion pays=C2=A01 more fatigue than healer who chose the tavctil=C2=A0option=
 (for all healer abilities). But that is changing the healer skill.
=C2=A0
either way IMO it is an unnecessary complication to a complex combat system=
..

Ian

--- On Tue, 1/2/11, Bernard Hoggins <nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:


From: Bernard Hoggins <nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Date: Tuesday, 1, February, 2011, 6:18 PM






Much as I'm for simplicity, ditching the SC penelty means there is no reaso=
n to not take Non Tactile Empathy.

As, per the healer rules....

You can always do tactile empathy by touch.
Non tactile grants you 1 more ability.=C2=A0 The ability to sense someones =
surface emotions at a range.=C2=A0 Not a very big ability, and non tactile =
doesn't actually let you use any healer abilities at range as per the curre=
nt rules in the book, but it doesn't cost you anything other than a higher =
strike chance penelty.

So if the penelty is removed, suddenly there is no cost for taking non tact=
ile empathy compared to tactile empathy.

From Bernard Hoggins
nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk

--- On Tue, 1/2/11, Neil Davies <nsdavies@gmail.com> wrote:


From: Neil Davies <nsdavies@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Received: Tuesday, 1 February, 2011, 9:14 AM


It is very pleasing to see all the replies, mostly saying "ditch it".=C2=A0=
=20

I totally agree :-)

Ian's point sums it up : this is supposed to be a game not a simulation.

How about putting it to the vote?

On 29 January 2011 23:53, Helen Saggers <helen@darksoft.co.nz> wrote:





=C2=A0
I=E2=80=99m with Ian Wood, If we are going to =E2=80=9Cfix it=E2=80=9D let=
=E2=80=99s just do so by doing away with the dam thing.
In the interests of tree conservation and saving printer ink here is how I =
handle the differing SC on a printed character sheet.
Thorn my Master Warrior/Healer=C2=A0 has trained in some 30+ different weap=
ons. For 11 of these weapons her Healers tactile empathy penalty may change=
 or may not apply depending on whether the weapon is used in close, melee o=
r at range. My solution was not another column or another line on the chara=
cter sheet but to work out how the weapon was most likely to be used and ca=
lculate the SC to that usage. Then I note to which of the 2 or 3 uses the S=
C is calculated to by making the letter visibly different (its bold) on the=
 use column of my Character sheet, so that I know in 5 yrs time which use i=
ts calculating the SC based on and how to adjust it if I do something diffe=
rent... like throw a Battle Axe at someone not multi-hex strike them.
E.g. A Dagger is mostly a close weapon for someone who regularly uses a han=
d & =C2=BD sword even though it can be used at Range in Melee or Close, so =
my character sheet has under use RMC. Then come game time I use my sword (S=
C calc=E2=80=99d for melee) until I get into close and then swap to the dag=
ger and use the numbers on the sheet. If I somehow end up in a melee Dagger=
 fight or choose to disarm myself by throwing the thing for some reason the=
n I can adjust the SC accordingly.
The thing is while a character may have the skill to use many weapons they =
are creatures of habit, they usually only regularly use 3 or 4 weapons, and=
 they mostly use then the same way,...e.g. Bow for Range, Battle Axe for me=
lee, Dagger or Unarmed for close, so they only need the one set of SC for 9=
0% of the time.
Helen

=C2=A0
--0-1120442675-1296541768=:87099
Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<table cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" border=3D"0" ><tr><td valign=3D"=
top" style=3D"font: inherit;"><DIV>i thought there was a fatigue cost for n=
on-tactile option (which counts even if you are touching.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>I would make that mean the healer who chose the&nbsp;non-tactile empat=
hy option pays&nbsp;1 more fatigue than healer who chose the tavctil&nbsp;o=
ption (for all healer abilities). But that is changing the healer skill.</D=
IV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>either way IMO it is an unnecessary complication to a complex combat s=
ystem.<BR></DIV>
<DIV>Ian</DIV>
<DIV><BR>--- On <B>Tue, 1/2/11, Bernard Hoggins <I>&lt;nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk=
&gt;</I></B> wrote:<BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5=
px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px"><BR>From: Bernard Hoggins &lt;nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk&gt=
;<BR>Subject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty<BR>To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz<BR>Date: Tu=
esday, 1, February, 2011, 6:18 PM<BR><BR>
<DIV id=3Dyiv1445717012>
<TABLE border=3D0 cellSpacing=3D0 cellPadding=3D0>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=3Dtop>Much as I'm for simplicity, ditching the SC penelty means =
there is no reason to not take Non Tactile Empathy.<BR><BR>As, per the heal=
er rules....<BR><BR>You can always do tactile empathy by touch.<BR>Non tact=
ile grants you 1 more ability.&nbsp; The ability to sense someones surface =
emotions at a range.&nbsp; Not a very big ability, and non tactile doesn't =
actually let you use any healer abilities at range as per the current rules=
 in the book, but it doesn't cost you anything other than a higher strike c=
hance penelty.<BR><BR>So if the penelty is removed, suddenly there is no co=
st for taking non tactile empathy compared to tactile empathy.<BR><BR>From =
Bernard Hoggins<BR>nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk<BR><BR>--- On <B>Tue, 1/2/11, Neil =
Davies <I>&lt;nsdavies@gmail.com&gt;</I></B> wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5=
px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px"><BR>From: Neil Davies &lt;nsdavies@gmail.com&gt;<BR>S=
ubject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty<BR>To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz<BR>Received: Tues=
day, 1 February, 2011, 9:14 AM<BR><BR>
<DIV id=3Dyiv1445717012yiv681277569>It is very pleasing to see all the repl=
ies, mostly saying "ditch it".&nbsp; <BR><BR>I totally agree :-)<BR><BR>Ian=
's point sums it up : this is supposed to be a game not a simulation.<BR><B=
R>How about putting it to the vote?<BR><BR>On 29 January 2011 23:53, Helen =
Saggers <SPAN dir=3Dltr>&lt;<A rel=3Dnofollow>helen@darksoft.co.nz</A>&gt;<=
/SPAN> wrote:<BR>
<DIV class=3Dyiv1445717012yiv681277569gmail_quote>
<BLOCKQUOTE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid; MARGIN: 0pt 0=
pt 0pt 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3Dyiv1445717012yiv681277569gmail_quo=
te>
<DIV lang=3DEN-NZ>
<DIV>
<P class=3Dyiv1445717012yiv681277569MsoNormal><SPAN style=3D"COLOR: rgb(31,=
73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">&nbsp;</SPAN></DIV>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3Dyiv1445717012yiv681277569MsoNormal=
><SPAN style=3D"COLOR: rgb(31,73,125)">I=E2=80=99m with Ian Wood, If we are=
 going to =E2=80=9Cfix it=E2=80=9D let=E2=80=99s just do so by doing away w=
ith the dam thing.</SPAN></DIV>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3Dyiv1445717012yiv681277569MsoNormal=
><SPAN style=3D"COLOR: rgb(31,73,125)">In the interests of tree conservatio=
n and saving printer ink here is how I handle the differing SC on a printed=
 character sheet.</SPAN></DIV>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3Dyiv1445717012yiv681277569MsoNormal=
><SPAN style=3D"COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Thorn my Master War=
rior/Healer&nbsp; has trained in some 30+ different weapons. For 11 of thes=
e weapons her Healers tactile empathy penalty may change or may not apply d=
epending on whether the weapon is used in close, melee or at range. My solu=
tion was not another column or another line on the character sheet but to w=
ork out how the weapon was most likely to be used and calculate the SC to t=
hat usage. Then I note to which of the 2 or 3 uses the SC is calculated to =
by making the letter visibly different (its bold) on the use column of my C=
haracter sheet, so that I know in 5 yrs time which use its calculating the =
SC based on and how to adjust it if I do something different... like throw =
a Battle Axe at someone not multi-hex strike them.</SPAN></DIV>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3Dyiv1445717012yiv681277569MsoNormal=
><SPAN style=3D"COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">E.g. A Dagger is mo=
stly a close weapon for someone who regularly uses a hand &amp; =C2=BD swor=
d even though it can be used at Range in Melee or Close, so my character sh=
eet has under use RM<B>C. </B>Then come game time I use my sword (SC calc=
=E2=80=99d for melee) until I get into close and then swap to the dagger an=
d use the numbers on the sheet. If I somehow end up in a melee Dagger fight=
 or choose to disarm myself by throwing the thing for some reason then I ca=
n adjust the SC accordingly.</SPAN></DIV>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3Dyiv1445717012yiv681277569MsoNormal=
><SPAN style=3D"COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">The thing is while =
a character may have the skill to use many weapons they are creatures of ha=
bit, they usually only regularly use 3 or 4 weapons, and they mostly use th=
en the same way,...e.g. Bow for Range, Battle Axe for melee, Dagger or Unar=
med for close, so they only need the one set of SC for 90% of the time.</SP=
AN></DIV>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt" class=3Dyiv1445717012yiv681277569MsoNormal=
><SPAN style=3D"COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt">Helen</SPAN></DIV><=
/DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></TD></TR></TBODY></TA=
BLE><BR>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></td></tr></table>
--0-1120442675-1296541768=:87099--


-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --

--0-829142584-1296543324=:21729
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

The fatigue cost is only for using the 'Sense emotions' ability which non t=
actile Empathy grants.=C2=A0 Normal use of Empathy by touch is exactly the =
same for both.

From Bernard Hoggins
=0Anevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk

--- On Tue, 1/2/11, Ian Wood <dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz> wrote:

From: Ian Wood <dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Received: Tuesday, 1 February, 2011, 7:29 PM

i thought there was a fatigue cost for non-tactile option (which counts eve=
n if you are touching.=0A=C2=A0=0AI would make that mean the healer who cho=
se the=C2=A0non-tactile empathy option pays=C2=A01 more fatigue than healer=
 who chose the tavctil=C2=A0option (for all healer abilities). But that is =
changing the healer skill.=0A=C2=A0=0Aeither way IMO it is an unnecessary c=
omplication to a complex combat system.
=0AIan=0A
--- On Tue, 1/2/11, Bernard Hoggins <nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
=0A
From: Bernard Hoggins <nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Date: Tuesday, 1, February, 2011, 6:18 PM

=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AMuch as I'm for simplicity, ditching the SC penelty means th=
ere is no reason to not take Non Tactile Empathy.

As, per the healer rules....

You can always do tactile empathy by touch.
Non tactile grants you 1 more ability.=C2=A0 The ability to sense someones =
surface emotions at a range.=C2=A0 Not a very big ability, and non tactile =
doesn't actually let you use any healer abilities at range as per the curre=
nt rules in the book, but it doesn't cost you anything other than a higher =
strike chance penelty.

So if the penelty is removed, suddenly there is no cost for taking non tact=
ile empathy compared to tactile empathy.

From Bernard Hoggins
nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk

--- On Tue, 1/2/11, Neil Davies <nsdavies@gmail.com> wrote:
=0A
From: Neil Davies <nsdavies@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty
To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz
Received: Tuesday, 1 February, 2011, 9:14 AM

=0AIt is very pleasing to see all the replies, mostly saying "ditch it".=C2=
=A0=20

I totally agree :-)

Ian's point sums it up : this is supposed to be a game not a simulation.

How about putting it to the vote?

On 29 January 2011 23:53, Helen Saggers <helen@darksoft.co.nz> wrote:
=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=C2=A0=0AI=E2=80=99m with Ian Wood, If we are going to =E2=
=80=9Cfix it=E2=80=9D let=E2=80=99s just do so by doing away with the dam t=
hing.=0AIn the interests of tree conservation and saving printer ink here i=
s how I handle the differing SC on a printed character sheet.=0AThorn my Ma=
ster Warrior/Healer=C2=A0 has trained in some 30+ different weapons. For 11=
 of these weapons her Healers tactile empathy penalty may change or may not=
 apply depending on whether the weapon is used in close, melee or at range.=
 My solution was not another column or another line on the character sheet =
but to work out how the weapon was most likely to be used and calculate the=
 SC to that usage. Then I note to which of the 2 or 3 uses the SC is calcul=
ated to by making the letter visibly different (its bold) on the use column=
 of my Character sheet, so that I know in 5 yrs time which use its calculat=
ing the SC based on and how to adjust it if I do something different... lik=
e throw a Battle Axe at someone not multi-hex strike them.=0AE.g. A Dagger =
is mostly a close weapon for someone who regularly uses a hand & =C2=BD swo=
rd even though it can be used at Range in Melee or Close, so my character s=
heet has under use RMC. Then come game time I use my sword (SC calc=E2=80=
=99d for melee) until I get into close and then swap to the dagger and use =
the numbers on the sheet. If I somehow end up in a melee Dagger fight or ch=
oose to disarm myself by throwing the thing for some reason then I can adju=
st the SC accordingly.=0AThe thing is while a character may have the skill =
to use many weapons they are creatures of habit, they usually only regularl=
y use 3 or 4 weapons, and they mostly use then the same way,...e.g. Bow for=
 Range, Battle Axe for melee, Dagger or Unarmed for close, so they only nee=
d the one set of SC for 90% of the time.=0AHelen

=C2=A0=0A=0A=0A      
--0-829142584-1296543324=:21729
Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<table cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" border=3D"0" ><tr><td valign=3D"=
top" style=3D"font: inherit;">The fatigue cost is only for using the 'Sense=
 emotions' ability which non tactile Empathy grants.&nbsp; Normal use of Em=
pathy by touch is exactly the same for both.<br><br>From Bernard Hoggins<br=
>=0Anevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk<br><br>--- On <b>Tue, 1/2/11, Ian Wood <i>&lt;dawn=
haven@xtra.co.nz&gt;</i></b> wrote:<br><blockquote style=3D"border-left: 2p=
x solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px;"><br>From: I=
an Wood &lt;dawnhaven@xtra.co.nz&gt;<br>Subject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty=
<br>To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>Received: Tuesday, 1 February, 2011, 7:29 PM<br>=
<br><div id=3D"yiv467873591"><table border=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" cellspac=
ing=3D"0"><tbody><tr><td style=3D"font: inherit;" valign=3D"top"><div>i tho=
ught there was a fatigue cost for non-tactile option (which counts even if =
you are touching.</div>=0A<div>&nbsp;</div>=0A<div>I would make that mean t=
he healer who chose the&nbsp;non-tactile empathy option pays&nbsp;1 more fa=
tigue than healer who chose the tavctil&nbsp;option (for all healer abiliti=
es). But that is changing the healer skill.</div>=0A<div>&nbsp;</div>=0A<di=
v>either way IMO it is an unnecessary complication to a complex combat syst=
em.<br></div>=0A<div>Ian</div>=0A<div><br>--- On <b>Tue, 1/2/11, Bernard Ho=
ggins <i>&lt;nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk&gt;</i></b> wrote:<br></div>=0A<blockquot=
e style=3D"border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); padding-left: 5px; marg=
in-left: 5px;"><br>From: Bernard Hoggins &lt;nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk&gt;<br>Su=
bject: Re: [dq] Healer SC Penalty<br>To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>Date: Tuesday, =
1, February, 2011, 6:18 PM<br><br>=0A<div id=3D"yiv467873591">=0A<table bor=
der=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0">=0A<tbody>=0A<tr>=0A<td valig=
n=3D"top">Much as I'm for simplicity, ditching the SC penelty means there i=
s no reason to not take Non Tactile Empathy.<br><br>As, per the healer rule=
s....<br><br>You can always do tactile empathy by touch.<br>Non tactile gra=
nts you 1 more ability.&nbsp; The ability to sense someones surface emotion=
s at a range.&nbsp; Not a very big ability, and non tactile doesn't actuall=
y let you use any healer abilities at range as per the current rules in the=
 book, but it doesn't cost you anything other than a higher strike chance p=
enelty.<br><br>So if the penelty is removed, suddenly there is no cost for =
taking non tactile empathy compared to tactile empathy.<br><br>From Bernard=
 Hoggins<br>nevyn0ad@yahoo.co.uk<br><br>--- On <b>Tue, 1/2/11, Neil Davies =
<i>&lt;nsdavies@gmail.com&gt;</i></b> wrote:<br>=0A<blockquote style=3D"bor=
der-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px;"=
><br>From: Neil Davies &lt;nsdavies@gmail.com&gt;<br>Subject: Re: [dq] Heal=
er SC Penalty<br>To: dq@dq.sf.org.nz<br>Received: Tuesday, 1 February, 2011=
, 9:14 AM<br><br>=0A<div id=3D"yiv467873591yiv681277569">It is very pleasin=
g to see all the replies, mostly saying "ditch it".&nbsp; <br><br>I totally=
 agree :-)<br><br>Ian's point sums it up : this is supposed to be a game no=
t a simulation.<br><br>How about putting it to the vote?<br><br>On 29 Janua=
ry 2011 23:53, Helen Saggers <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a rel=3D"nofollow">hele=
n@darksoft.co.nz</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>=0A<div class=3D"yiv467873591yiv6=
81277569gmail_quote">=0A<blockquote style=3D"border-left: 1px solid rgb(204=
, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;" class=3D"yiv467=
873591yiv681277569gmail_quote">=0A<div lang=3D"EN-NZ">=0A<div>=0A<p class=
=3D"yiv467873591yiv681277569MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 12=
5); font-size: 11pt;">&nbsp;</span></p></div>=0A<p style=3D"margin-bottom: =
12pt;" class=3D"yiv467873591yiv681277569MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color: rg=
b(31, 73, 125);">I=E2=80=99m with Ian Wood, If we are going to =E2=80=9Cfix=
 it=E2=80=9D let=E2=80=99s just do so by doing away with the dam thing.</sp=
an></p></div>=0A<p style=3D"margin-bottom: 12pt;" class=3D"yiv467873591yiv6=
81277569MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">In the interest=
s of tree conservation and saving printer ink here is how I handle the diff=
ering SC on a printed character sheet.</span></p></blockquote></div>=0A<p s=
tyle=3D"margin-bottom: 12pt;" class=3D"yiv467873591yiv681277569MsoNormal"><=
span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt;">Thorn my Master Wa=
rrior/Healer&nbsp; has trained in some 30+ different weapons. For 11 of the=
se weapons her Healers tactile empathy penalty may change or may not apply =
depending on whether the weapon is used in close, melee or at range. My sol=
ution was not another column or another line on the character sheet but to =
work out how the weapon was most likely to be used and calculate the SC to =
that usage. Then I note to which of the 2 or 3 uses the SC is calculated to=
 by making the letter visibly different (its bold) on the use column of my =
Character sheet, so that I know in 5 yrs time which use its calculating the=
 SC based on and how to adjust it if I do something different... like throw=
 a Battle Axe at someone not multi-hex strike them.</span></p></div>=0A<p s=
tyle=3D"margin-bottom: 12pt;" class=3D"yiv467873591yiv681277569MsoNormal"><=
span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt;">E.g. A Dagger is m=
ostly a close weapon for someone who regularly uses a hand &amp; =C2=BD swo=
rd even though it can be used at Range in Melee or Close, so my character s=
heet has under use RM<b>C. </b>Then come game time I use my sword (SC calc=
=E2=80=99d for melee) until I get into close and then swap to the dagger an=
d use the numbers on the sheet. If I somehow end up in a melee Dagger fight=
 or choose to disarm myself by throwing the thing for some reason then I ca=
n adjust the SC accordingly.</span>=0A</p><p style=3D"margin-bottom: 12pt;"=
 class=3D"yiv467873591yiv681277569MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125); font-size: 11pt;">The thing is while a character may have the ski=
ll to use many weapons they are creatures of habit, they usually only regul=
arly use 3 or 4 weapons, and they mostly use then the same way,...e.g. Bow =
for Range, Battle Axe for melee, Dagger or Unarmed for close, so they only =
need the one set of SC for 90% of the time.</span>=0A</p><p style=3D"margin=
-bottom: 12pt;" class=3D"yiv467873591yiv681277569MsoNormal"><span style=3D"=
color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-size: 11pt;">Helen</span></p></blockquote><br=
></td></tr></tbody></table><br>&nbsp;</div></blockquote></td></tr></tbody><=
/table></div></blockquote></td></tr></table><br>=0A=0A=0A=0A      &nbsp;
--0-829142584-1296543324=:21729--


-- to unsubscribe notify mailto:dq-request@dq.sf.org.nz --